New developments in automotive - Effect of TS implementation in companies using Lean

[Paul Simpson]

Re: New developments in automotive - Effect of TS implementation in companies using L

The jury is still out but it's not looking good for the integrators.

Thanks to all for the feedback and especially to tyker for taking the time to show me round the plant.

A couple of snippets (from my limited sample):

- Most organizations do not make a strategic move to integrate QMS (to TS) and their lean programmes. At best they evolve closer over time and sometimes they are deliberately kept apart
- Most TS organization have it as a licence to trade and will do what they have to to keep the badge
- Audits to TS are variable and from country to country there are horrendous differences / flouting of the IATF rules

Confidentiality prevents me from naming any names here. I'd appreciate any feedback or further examples.

 

[AndyN]

Re: New developments in automotive - Effect of TS implementation in companies using L

Paul:
I remember a situation where a company had started out on a major implementation of 'standardized work'. This involved just about every level of management and supervision, in addition to the floor personnel, defining their regular, 'must do' work, for each day, week, month and year. Examples included the preparation of budgets (yearly), the reporting of expenses (weekly), the 'OJT' evaluations, (monthly) etc. etc.

By doing this, the organization had quickly identified a lot of non-value added activities and, therefore, waste. It was truely amazing (to me) to see what a simple exercise like this could do to free up peoples' time and focus on elimination of waste, by looking at what we do, regularly, to 'work around' processes which are broken.

This 'standardized work' was never considered as part of the qms. None of the documented procedures and work instructions reflected these value-added activities and the lists (and checklists) of each persons standard work, was never considered during internal audits, even though management were pretty rigorous about following it.

My belief is that the whole concept of having documented procedures, processes and 'criteria and methods' (defined in section 4.0 of ISO 9001:2000) could be very well met by the identification of 'standard work'. Such an approach could move an organization past simply 'complying' with the qms to making it a very effective and efficient system of robust, capable and in-control processes........

Andy

 

[Paul Simpson]

Draft article

Just to keep covers in the loop. Please find attached the draft of an article for the CQI. I believe there will be changes (pulling some information about the poor certification process) but this is what I wanted.

 

[Paul Simpson]

Re: New developments in automotive - Effect of TS implementation in companies using L

Although my article is in Quality World it isn't up on the web site. This article by Paul Hardiman is, though. Click here. It covers similar areas.

 

[Paul Simpson]

Another plug

Just in case you were interested. Here is a link to the CQI forum where I posted my TS article. Here is the CQI forum discussing another article in the same edition of Qualityworld talking about Lean and I have responded.

If you have a look around the Forum our old friend Jim Wade is active. I have disbarred myself because the moderation of the forum leaves a lot to be desired!

Can anyone believe I upset someone there?

 

[AndyN]

Re: New developments in automotive - Effect of TS implementation in companies using L

Hello Paul:

That was an interesting tirade by Mr. Brinklow.

I, for one, am a huge advocate of Lean, but not the way in which most folks go about it. Clearly it works, since Toyota continue to 'kick butt' with their relentless focus on waste reduction and improvements. Most of the companies I deal with cannot relate the ISO/TS 16949 requirements to the Lean Tools, and, as a result, their QMS and Lean Initiatives are fundamentally different worlds, with different resources, budgets, timelines etc.

Maybe what's needed is a good book to be written which shows how the two compliment each other........

 

[tyker]

Re: Another plug

Just in case you were interested. Here is a link to the CQI forum where I posted my TS article. Here is the CQI forum discussing another article in the same edition of Qualityworld talking about Lean and I have responded.

If you have a look around the Forum our old friend Jim Wade is active. I have disbarred myself because the moderation of the forum leaves a lot to be desired!

Can anyone believe I upset someone there?

Paul
Thanks for the link to the CQI thread.
I posted my response to Paul Hardiman's article on that site because I thought it would elicit more response from the CQI members. The forum is hardly a dynamic one and I'd stopped checking for replies after it was ignored for so long. It is difficult to believe you upset someone there as they all appear to be hibernating.

My post on that site asked if others were getting much attention to their lean programmes from their external TS 16949 auditors. Perhaps a Cover or two might care to respond.

 

[Paul Simpson]

Re: New developments in automotive - Effect of TS implementation in companies using L

Sorry, Tyker - I forgot to give you the credit for starting the thread. It is a good point that TS does not "require" lean - probably because you can't really define it well enough to make it auditable. Nevertheless there are opportunities to get auditors better versed in what lean is and for companies to integrate lean with ISO TS.

When working at Jaguar they integrated all their lean activities into their QMS and audited it using trained auditors (in their version of lean - the Ford Production System).

 

[AndyN]

Re: New developments in automotive - Effect of TS implementation in companies using L

It is a good point that TS does not "require" lean - probably because you can't really define it well enough to make it auditable. Nevertheless there are opportunities to get auditors better versed in what lean is and for companies to integrate lean with ISO TS.

When working at Jaguar they integrated all their lean activities into their QMS and audited it using trained auditors (in their version of lean - the Ford Production System).

Wow, that's a nice twist, teaching auditors what 'lean' is! But I have to take issue Paul. Surely, Lean is well defined and it can be audited. I think what you're saying is that to move many CB auditors to recognize it would be difficult...........

Andy

 

[Helmut Jilling]

Re: Another plug

Paul
Thanks for the link to the CQI thread.
I posted my response to Paul Hardiman's article on that site because I thought it would elicit more response from the CQI members. The forum is hardly a dynamic one and I'd stopped checking for replies after it was ignored for so long. It is difficult to believe you upset someone there as they all appear to be hibernating.

My post on that site asked if others were getting much attention to their lean programmes from their external TS 16949 auditors. Perhaps a Cover or two might care to respond.

Many of my TS clients have active Lean Programs. I interface with it to the degree that it is intergated with their Continual Improvement process, but I don't dig deep. It is somewhat at the edge of the TS scope, except that they integrated it.

I see a lot of good stuff, however. Lean fits very well into a good TS system.