New Gage R&R - Attribute gage supplied by my customer

J

Jay Sturgeon

#1
I have an attribute gage supplied by my customer. They are asking me to perform Gagr R&R studies for this gage. The problem I have outside of the fact the gage maker should have done the study before the gage got to me is......

There is an indicator check on this gage which obviously is going to be varable data.

My first question is should I do the study based on this characteristic alone and report it as a variable study?

My second question is what does everyone think is my recourse if the study fails the gage?

Would appreciate all your input.

Thanks,

:confused:
 
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R

Rob Nix

#2
Two words: Contract Review. Was this "requirement" stated (documented) prior to the receipt of the order? Is this request made by some loose cannon within the customer's organization? If so, get concurrence from his boss.

If your customer is asking you to do them a favor and check the R&R on their gage, you have to determine first whether to charge them for it or whether it is just good customer relations to do it for them. There should be no repercussions whether the results are good or bad (we've done that for our customers many times).

As far as whether it is an attribute or variable check, you should ask your customer (in writing) what they want - get THEM to clarify THEIR expectations.

Anyway, I hope this helps a little.
 

Wes Bucey

Quite Involved in Discussions
#3
Rob Nix said:
Two words: Contract Review. Was this "requirement" stated (documented) prior to the receipt of the order? Is this request made by some loose cannon within the customer's organization? If so, get concurrence from his boss.

If your customer is asking you to do them a favor and check the R&R on their gage, you have to determine first whether to charge them for it or whether it is just good customer relations to do it for them. There should be no repercussions whether the results are good or bad (we've done that for our customers many times).

As far as whether it is an attribute or variable check, you should ask your customer (in writing) what they want - get THEM to clarify THEIR expectations.

Anyway, I hope this helps a little.
I concur with Rob - CONTRACT REVIEW! If this was part of the initial contract, your organization should have agreed to parameters before acceptance.

If this is an "add-on" your organization should deal with it as if it is a new contract (fee, parameters etc.) Your organization and customer should agree on capability, process, capacity of your organization to complete the task for the agreed fee (zero for good will?).

In terms of the results, if everyone agrees on the parameters before the test, the results should be as honest and bias-free as possible. Everyone has to agree to let the chips fall where they may.

In terms of ANY customer-supplied material or instruments, an organization ought to treat (inspect, maintain, store, use, etc.) it the same way they treat similar material or instruments from any other supplier to ensure conformance to requirements. Just because the customer is the source does not make it perfect. Even if you can fix the blame for nonconformity on the customer later, why would you want to waste your time making scrap with nonconforming material or instruments?
 
J

Jay Sturgeon

#4
Contract Review

If this is an "add-on" your organization should deal with it as if it is a new contract (fee, parameters etc.) Your organization and customer should agree on capability, process, capacity of your organization to complete the task for the agreed fee (zero for good will?).

In terms of the results, if everyone agrees on the parameters before the test, the results should be as honest and bias-free as possible. Everyone has to agree to let the chips fall where they may.

In terms of ANY customer-supplied material or instruments, an organization ought to treat (inspect, maintain, store, use, etc.) it the same way they treat similar material or instruments from any other supplier to ensure conformance to requirements. Just because the customer is the source does not make it perfect. Even if you can fix the blame for nonconformity on the customer later, why would you want to waste your time making scrap with nonconforming material or instruments?

Contract Review aye.....nope this is an add on and there won't be any charges. That said I have copied the email I just sent to the customer. Names have been changes to protect the innocent, namely me.


Fred,

I have finished Gage Instructions and they are attached.

I have a couple of questions with regard to the gage R&R:
1. There are several things on the gage that are supposed to be revised per John Doe when he was here for the run off. I have attached a copy of the needed changes. One of those changes was to shorten the trim check pins to allow the part to be loaded without having to tilt it. Until this is done I believe we may have negative results on the Gage R&R. Do you want me to do a Gage R&R now or after those changes are made. Bill Doe was to get back with us on when the gage was to go back to the gage shop. The gage will be available to go back to the gage shop early next week.

2. Also, could you please ask Bill's brother to define for me his expectations for the Gage R&R. I am curious if the gage shop did a Gage R&R, I'm not sure that has been stated. If they did I would like to get a copy of it and the print for the gage. We will need the print for future gage certification and may need it for the R&R results analysis.

One of the changes to the gage was to allow the part to be loaded with having to tilt it into position. This tilting could negatively affect the R&R as that deals with an attribute (digital indicator check).

I appreciate all of your input. Unfortunately I live in the automotive world where QS & TS are spoken loadly, but so much for standardiztion.

Thanks again and feel free to comment on the email.

:bonk:
 
B

ben sortin

#5
Conduct the study as the customer has requested it.

Notify the customer that your process/product controls will utilize variable data.

Notify customer when the gage does not meet your needs for continuous improvement.

Make sure you can convince the customer that your gage is superior prior to purchase and implementation.
 
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