New Job 1 Month from Recertification Audit - Missing Documents, no Internal Audits

#1
Recently I started a new job. They have their recert audit April 1.
They have no internal audits, and no management meetings to speak of.
Last QM quit in October.
What to do?
We make a large support item for the military... they know of the poor shape of the company and are about ready to pull the plug on us.
I'm honest and truthful with the military quality people, I have no idea what to do about the ISO Audit.
Please Help!
 
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ManTheDan88

#2
Re: New Job 1 Month from Recertification Audit - Missing Documents, no Internal Audit

Is it the three year re-certification audit? If it is I think you're in pretty bad shape. If its a surveillance audit you might be able to get by with notes for the internal audit and management review and say your in the process of finalizing the documentation. You'll get hit with with some non-conformities for both most likely but it won't be as bad as having nothing. You might want to buckle down and stay overtime to try to get one of them done and ask management for all the resources you need. If the company knows their on thin ice with their military contract then I'm sure they'll offer anything you need to get through the audit.
 
#3
Re: New Job 1 Month from Recertification Audit - Missing Documents, no Internal Audit

Recently I started a new job. They have their recert audit April 1.
They have no internal audits, and no management meetings to speak of.
Last QM quit in October.
What to do?
We make a large support item for the military... they know of the poor shape of the company and are about ready to pull the plug on us.
I'm honest and truthful with the military quality people, I have no idea what to do about the ISO Audit.
Please Help!
Here's what I'd do:
Do a whole systems internal audit (I'm guessing you know how) so you immediately have some evidence of IA. Meet the top manager and tell them the facts - they will lose business because they don't have a certificate (can't be on the bid list etc), that the problems you found are the reasons for waste and $$ lost. Show them the benefits of EVERYONE having a part in recovering.

Then call a meeting of the management team and go over the findings - that's a management review. Throw in some items like performance of current delivery, or customer complaints and tell them they need to fix this or they are going to lose their certification and you aren't responsible for that, nor for keeping it. The auditor will know the management team having been doing it before you got there to help.

Now they've had a "come to Jesus" meeting, with the bosses support, meet with each process owner and develop a recovery plan. Create a binder with 4 tabs - the ISO requirements etc for their process, then their process and its documentation, a tab for performance results fro process and/or products. Last tab is actions to correct or improve.

Have another management review - this time a "show and tell" when each process owner tells everyone else what is in their binder. Record it as management review. Add more IA results.

Once they take action, then do more audits to ensure the people get the process.

Ace your visit with the CB!
 

Randy

Super Moderator
#4
Re: New Job 1 Month from Recertification Audit - Missing Documents, no Internal Audit

I'm retired military and suffered under poor quality from contractors, so if they think so little of their own business they can't really care an iota about the product they supply. There has to be a company making the same material with a higher level of integrity.

What you have inherited isn't an organizations QMS you've inherited a former QM's quality system and if nothing has been done, nobody cares, and you'll have a fight from the time you start until you run out the door screaming like a mad man
 

Kronos147

Trusted Information Resource
#5
Re: New Job 1 Month from Recertification Audit - Missing Documents, no Internal Audit

What you have inherited... (is) a former QM's quality system and if nothing has been done, nobody cares, and you'll have a fight from the time you start until you run out the door screaming like a mad man
Great point.
 

LUV-d-4UM

Quite Involved in Discussions
#6
Re: New Job 1 Month from Recertification Audit - Missing Documents, no Internal Audit

Is it the three year re-certification audit? If it is I think you're in pretty bad shape. If its a surveillance audit you might be able to get by with notes for the internal audit and management review and say your in the process of finalizing the documentation. You'll get hit with with some non-conformities for both most likely but it won't be as bad as having nothing. You might want to buckle down and stay overtime to try to get one of them done and ask management for all the resources you need. If the company knows their on thin ice with their military contract then I'm sure they'll offer anything you need to get through the audit.
I suggest that you write a major NC to you QMS and hold a Management Review for actions. the Root Cause of this major is the lose of resource and no succession planning. You will recover and get this back on track. Good Luck and congratulation in your job security. You are in for a long haul. But there is a light at the end of this tunnel.
:agree:
 

Jen Kirley

Quality and Auditing Expert
Staff member
Admin
#7
Re: New Job 1 Month from Recertification Audit - Missing Documents, no Internal Audit

Welcome to the Cove!

Do you mean there have been no audits at all since your site's last certification audit? Or none in the last year?

In either case, Andy's advice was excellent. :applause: I agree the first place to start is with a complete audit.

Don't forget to make your audit schedule for the upcoming cycle too. Decide how you will include in your audit planning the status and importance of processes (some are naturally more deserving of a closer look, keep in mind nothing says everything must be audited every year - but I bet you knew that) and the results from previous audit.

Enter the nonconformances into your system and start working on the most important ones. You won't be expected to have closed them before your April audit. Ditto what Andy said about the management reviews too. :agree:

Is there an idea that the quality manager is THE quality management system? If that is the case, it is your job to clear up the misunderstanding. As you no doubt know, ISO 9001 clearly states the requirement for management commitment. But I can not see inside your system, so I am thinking it is possible your old QM was not a very good administrator (poor organizational skills and not a good facilitator) which you can fix. And it must be done, for ISO certification has become a key qualification for military contractors. Like Andy said, everyone wins here if everyone plays to his or her potential.

Please let us know how this goes for you. You are among friends here at the Cove.
 

Randy

Super Moderator
#8
Re: New Job 1 Month from Recertification Audit - Missing Documents, no Internal Audit

Yeah man, I wish you the best of luck. I don't do anything but 3rd party work and I've seen your situation repeated over and over again, and here's the deal....Nobody but a really in tune auditor pays attention to the language of the ISO 9001 standard, specifically clause 4.1 where it states and is an absolute, and total requirement...."The organization shall establish, document, implement and maintain a quality management system...."

From your statement "maintain" has not happened and unless you get a typical shake & bake auditor your QMS will be found out...No audits, no management reviews, no corrective actions from finding no audits or management reviews, and tons of other really low hanging fruit could lead to a various serious condition of "not maintaining the QMS" which is a major requirement embedded in the very 1st sentence of the 9001 standard, and you've only provided the obvious ... What horror stories are still unidentified?

It's only my opinion, which isn't worth very much because of my lack of being a really nice guy and PC, but as it is right now, you're up the proverbial "S" creek without much of a paddle and "YOU" can't fix it by yourself, it's an organizational issue and definitely a management one which they obviously care not to get involved in or with...How do I know? You stated that the company was in trouble anyway and the client is aware of the company's poor shape.

At this time the best course of action is an extreme course of damage control trying to minimize the impact and it has to start at the top with more than "ya, ya, lip service" from your management....If they don't walk the talk, none else will either.
 

Alpine

Involved In Discussions
#10
Re: New Job 1 Month from Recertification Audit - Missing Documents, no Internal Audit

I was in a similar position to what you describe when I started my current job. While the vast majority of us take pride in our work and strive to do the best we can for our employers, sadly there occasionally will be someone who is not of a similar mind. You have come across one such person, as I unfortunately did as well. My advise is simple, the approach I took is along the lines of what Andy recommended. In situations such as these, you must draw the line in the sand. You inherited the mess, the past is not your fault. In my case the external audit had already been delayed 6 months, so I could not put it off any longer. I grabbed the bull by the horns, raised many non-conformances on my own system and showed that I had a plan. The CB was not happy with the past but could clearly see where I was heading and was happy. The next audit confirmed that as I implemented what I said I would. So my advise is take a deep breath and get stuck into it.
 
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