New Service Company wants ISO 9001 Certification - 20 People in company

[Old Quality Gal]

Re: New Service Company - 20 People - Wants ISO 9001 !

CoKo,
ISO 9004 is indeed a great place to start.
I think pursuing compliance is worthwhile for a start up even if you do not go for certification.
One of my clients is a start-up that began with 5 people when I started talking to them and now they are at 150 employees in two years. They would have suffered even more growing pains than they did if they didn't have good process based documentation and a decent training program.
They actually had a very large customer who headed them towards registration in their early days. The company, BP, wanted some assurance that though they were small they had a mature system they could relate to and ISO 9001:2000 fit the bill. They too are a service organization.
Just a couple of bits of advice.
1.) Document your processes and develop your documentation with the resources and facilities you actually have in place. I have seen small companies make the rookie mistake of thinking they need to write documentation as if they had a 50,000 sq foot office and 200 employees.
Write what you actually do and change what you do based on a gap with the standard or as a thought out correction because it isn't giving you the results you want.
2.) Don't get hung up on reengineering the process. A great American philosopher Yogi Berra said "If you don't know where your going any road will take you there." strive for process consistency first. If you can get everyone doing things roughly the same way over and over and even if it is a lousy process it will pop right out at you and you will have the empirical data to make the right changes.
3.) Don't over-write. Less is more. Think of each document as a tool. If it does not have a purpose or use don't do it. The standard doesn't ask you for anything that isn't potentially useful in most businesses. If you write a bunch of stuff just to impress the auditor you are just setting yourself up for misery. Someone else gave you good advice.

• Identify your core business processes. I am a flowchart fan but at least diagram them out in some fashion. Identify where they touch each other. That is where most processes fall apart when the handoff to another process occurs.
• Match them up with resources they will require by responsibility
• What documentation do you need to support the process? If all roads lead to Rome just describe Rome. If you want them to take a particular road then create more detail.
• Train people using the documentation and then set up a couple of measures to track for results. That will lead you to developing some internal CAR process actions.

This should be enough to get you started. The people here are a great resource and enormously helpful.
Good luck to you. Keep us posted, no pun intended.

 

[CoKoOPERATOR]

Re: New Service Company - 20 People - Wants ISO 9001 !

:mg:

I just had a meeting with my superiors a couple of days ago.
I expressed them my feelings about the situation.
I explained them that implemending an ISO standard is a crucial point for the organization and its departments.
They said that I should not worry and that some parts of the ISO standard are already written.
They are planning to proceed to the implementation at the end of this month ,but I believe they do not care much to create a good ISO behaviour.
What do you think ?
Should I press them and try to stick in their heads the necessity for a better approach ?

I am a little afraid about it. They are my superiors. I allready work for 8 hours per day ,I need 4 hours per day for transportation and not much time is left for me.

They did not discuss anything about change of my position in the company, they did not give me a raise, they did not defined my level of responsibility and authority regarding the ISO thing.

Apart from all of the above I also study at the university for Business management.
Should I tell them to do the ISO stuff on their own ?

 

[fuzzy]

Re: New Service Company - 20 People - Wants ISO 9001 !

:mg:

Should I press them and try to stick in their heads the necessity for a better approach ?

I am a little afraid about it. They are my superiors. I allready work for 8 hours per day ,I need 4 hours per day for transportation and not much time is left for me.

They did not discuss anything about change of my position in the company, they did not give me a raise, they did not defined my level of responsibility and authority regarding the ISO thing.

Apart from all of the above I also study at the university for Business management.
Should I tell them to do the ISO stuff on their own ?

I think if you do, you may have a lot more time available for you... The choice is yours to make, but you may risk your job to tell the "ISO Truth" as you perceive it. We here cannot tell you what to do based on the limited understanding we will have of you, your bosses, and your business. I have worked my way quickly out the door at one job by telling my truths to a boss who didn't want to hear them It felt good to leave, but I was jobless for 18 months. Good Luck with your choice:

 

[Helmut Jilling]

Re: New Service Company - 20 People - Wants ISO 9001 !

:mg:

I just had a meeting with my superiors a couple of days ago.
I expressed them my feelings about the situation.
I explained them that implemending an ISO standard is a crucial point for the organization and its departments.
They said that I should not worry and that some parts of the ISO standard are already written.
They are planning to proceed to the implementation at the end of this month ,but I believe they do not care much to create a good ISO behaviour.
What do you think ?
Should I press them and try to stick in their heads the necessity for a better approach ?

I am a little afraid about it. They are my superiors. I allready work for 8 hours per day ,I need 4 hours per day for transportation and not much time is left for me.

They did not discuss anything about change of my position in the company, they did not give me a raise, they did not defined my level of responsibility and authority regarding the ISO thing.

Apart from all of the above I also study at the university for Business management.
Should I tell them to do the ISO stuff on their own ?

I don't think we should tell you what you should say to your bosses. However, remember, the standrad requires that the Management Rep position be a member of Management Team. Maybe there is a promotion for you? But, maybe they are not interested in doing it well. That is something you have to decide?

 

[Old Quality Gal]

Re: New Service Company - 20 People - Wants ISO 9001 !

:mg:

I just had a meeting with my superiors a couple of days ago.
I expressed them my feelings about the situation.
I explained them that implemending an ISO standard is a crucial point for the organization and its departments.
They said that I should not worry and that some parts of the ISO standard are already written.
They are planning to proceed to the implementation at the end of this month ,but I believe they do not care much to create a good ISO behaviour.
What do you think ?
Should I press them and try to stick in their heads the necessity for a better approach ?

I am a little afraid about it. They are my superiors. I allready work for 8 hours per day ,I need 4 hours per day for transportation and not much time is left for me.

They did not discuss anything about change of my position in the company, they did not give me a raise, they did not defined my level of responsibility and authority regarding the ISO thing.

Apart from all of the above I also study at the university for Business management.
Should I tell them to do the ISO stuff on their own ?

If you go back and read the original advice I gave you it sort of had this situation in mind.
I would not waste my time trying to convince them that it is time to revamp things in to a better system. If you are the management rep they need to understand what that means and give you the support and power you need to develop the system. I wouldn't go there about a raise at this point. I know I increase pay for results easier than before anything has really happened.
The best thing you can do in my opinion is to develop decent metrics that measure the impact of the processes you already have and the new ones you develop for registration.
The second thing you can do is really concentrate on developing a crack internal audit team. It doesn't need to be an army of people it can be really small but make sure they are good and have the right temperament and qualities to be good auditors. In my opinion that is the ability to grasp and understand processes as documented, the ability to ask questions and more importantly actively listen to what they are told ( harder than you might think), the diplomacy and people skills to have people spill their guts but never feel like they have been thrown under the bus by the auditor.
Audit frequently in the early going to existing or newly developed or changed documentation.
Take the fruit of all this and analyze the impact on the organization of how it is now in terms of effectiveness and good practice. These two methods should give you objective evidence to show management data that will ease them into decisions to improve this system they think is just fine or you might be surprised to find some elements are actually better than you thought.
You really are better off, in my opinion making slow steady progress based on real data from a marginally compliant system than trying to develop a perfect or model system in a vacuum.
To ring the bell on a good audit team one more time as I close here. I encourage the companies I work with to invest in decent auditor training even if they choose not to invest in anything else from a consulting or education perspective. Without exception down the road they always thank me for helping them develop a tool that will continue to give them valuable insight into the health of their business processes and one that puts them in a position of confidence to deal with 3rd party audits from their registrar and customers.
I tell clients before their first gap analysis that we will find they are likely 70% compliant even if it is shaky and inconsistent at best. It still gives them a starting point and gives them a foundation, however tentative to build on. Beware of telling your management that a total revolution is needed, even if you think so. Let the data and audit results speak for you. Let the inevitable positive impact of process consistency and improvement speak for you pulling the organization forward.
Eisenhower laid a string on a table during WWII in front of his generals and challenged them to push the string across the table. Then he asked them to pull it across. It was evident to all that it is easier to lead than to push. Like most military analogies it tends to work in business and life as well. Recognition and financial rewards may follow but at minimum as management rep you will understand your total business in ways you never did before and you will add to your skill set in a way that will go with you where ever you go.
Hope you find a couple of useful grains in this early morning ramble! Good luck to you and keep us informed.
Mary

 

[CoKoOPERATOR]

Re: New Service Company - 20 People - Wants ISO 9001 !


Thanks to you all.
I will certainly keep you informed about this story.
I will try to be as patient as I can and I will try to find out exactly what they have on their mind about the audit.
Maybe I worry too much for the company's future.
Anyway, I'll keep you informed.
Maybe this situation is similar to other small companies around the world.

 

[Helmut Jilling]

Re: New Service Company - 20 People - Wants ISO 9001 !

...
The best thing you can do in my opinion is to develop decent metrics that measure the impact of the processes you already have and the new ones you develop for registration.

The second thing you can do is really concentrate on developing a crack
internal audit team. It doesn't need to be an army of people it can be really small but make sure they are good and have the right temperament and qualities to be good auditors. In my opinion that is the ability to grasp and understand processes as documented, the ability to ask questions and more importantly actively listen to what they are told ( harder than you might think), the diplomacy and people skills to have people spill their guts but never feel like they have been thrown under the bus by the auditor.

....You really are better off, in my opinion making slow steady progress based on real data from a marginally compliant system than trying to develop a perfect or model system in a vacuum.

...To ring the bell on a good audit team one more time as I close here. I encourage the companies I work with to invest in decent auditor training even if they choose not to invest in anything else from a consulting or education perspective. Without exception down the road they always thank me for helping them develop a tool that will continue to give them valuable insight into the health of their business processes and one that puts them in a position of confidence to deal with 3rd party audits from their registrar and customers.

Eisenhower laid a string on a table during WWII in front of his generals and challenged them to push the string across the table. Then he asked them to pull it across. It was evident to all that it is easier to lead than to push.

Mary

Very well stated...and you used one of my favorite quotes - the ol' Eisenhower string quote (love it).

Quality Gal, If I ever bump into you somewhere, I think I owe you a beer, (or wine or coffee...)

 

[Old Quality Gal]

Re: New Service Company - 20 People - Wants ISO 9001 !

Very well stated...and you used one of my favorite quotes - the ol' Eisenhower string quote (love it).

Quality Gal, If I ever bump into you somewhere, I think I owe you a beer, (or wine or coffee...)

Your on but make mine a Guiness or Single Malt Scotch!
Thanks!

 

[Helmut Jilling]

Re: New Service Company - 20 People - Wants ISO 9001 !

Your on but make mine a Guiness or Single Malt Scotch!
Thanks!

A Guiness it is then (my fav)! ...You're quite the Lass!

 

[CoKoOPERATOR]

Re: New Service Company - 20 People - Wants ISO 9001 !

In just 10 days we are going to have the auditors for the certification. :truce:
What did they ask you during your company's audition ? :mg: Did they insist in any specific part of ISO 9001/2000 ?
I am curious !