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Non-conformity - Not performing Supplier Development on one specific supplier

V

vanputten

#21
#21
Not Responsible?

Hello Tyker:

If your organization is not responsible for the supplier's product quaility, then why do you perform receiving inspection, containment, sorting, correction etc and claim any costs back from the supplier?

If you do these things, seems to me that your organization would take an interest in the quality system of your supplier and "develop" it as required. The supplier's inputs to your QMS have an impact. If they didn't, you wouldn't inspect them, sort them, contain them, and charge back.

Or why don't you ask your customer for a waiver since they designated who the supplier is? I don't think your orgainzation's actions are complaint with TS 16949. You neither complied with the development part of the standard nor did you contact your customer and ask for a waiver. I see nothing in your posts that indicates your organization actively tried to be compliant to 7.4.1.2 until it became an N/C. I see no problems with what your registrar wrote up in the N/C.

Also, I do not see how the concept of customer supplied product applies here.

Regards,

Dirk
 
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D

db

#22
#22
vanputten said:
Also, I do not see how the concept of customer supplied product applies here.
Click to expand...
Since this was brought up, I've been thinking about it. In a purely theoretical sense, if in ISO 9000 a supplier is someone who supplies product, and if 7.4.1.2 requires supplier development, then if your customer supplied you product, would you be required to develop your customer? The first requirement (development) does not contain a customer waiver, the second requirement (registration) does. So, I suppose your customer could waive the registration part, but not the development requirement. This could get quite confusing. :confused:
 
Jim Wynne

Jim Wynne

Staff member
Admin
#23
#23
db said:
Since this was brought up, I've been thinking about it. In a purely theoretical sense, if in ISO 9000 a supplier is someone who supplies product, and if 7.4.1.2 requires supplier development, then if your customer supplied you product, would you be required to develop your customer? The first requirement (development) does not contain a customer waiver, the second requirement (registration) does. So, I suppose your customer could waive the registration part, but not the development requirement. This could get quite confusing. :confused:
Click to expand...
That was my earlier point. It's not at all as clear as some seem to believe. This needs to be worked out with the customer, and in my opinion the auditor should be credited for bringing it up, but should back off until it's settled.
 
T

tyker

#24
#24
I really am grateful for all the feedback.
My own view is that as 7.4.1.3 refers to customer approved sources, the use of the word "approved" would imply that the customer is carrying out the supplier QMS development required by 7.4.1.2 but perhaps I'm just being too simplistic.
I have discovered that, in this case, the supplier is indeed registered to TS so the problem goes away until the next time the customer moves the tools.
Once again, thank you.
 
J

jbGUERRA

#25
#25
Is it true as long as the supplier has a plan to become certified to at least ISO9001;2000 you pass the requirements needed 7.4.1.2?

The standard is clear, supplier shall be 3rd party registered unless otherwise specified by the customer. GM customer specific, March 2006, allows 2nd party audits "annually" however does not say anything about a plan to be certified?

Does this work for your auditors?:frust:
 
howste

howste

Thaumaturge
Super Moderator
#26
#26
jbGUERRA said:
Is it true as long as the supplier has a plan to become certified to at least ISO9001;2000 you pass the requirements needed 7.4.1.2?
Click to expand...
Yes, it's true - within the initial 3-year registration period. See the IATF guidance and the IAOB FAQ I posted above in post #17
http://elsmar.com/Forums/showpost.php?p=150695&postcount=17

jbGUERRA said:
The standard is clear, supplier shall be 3rd party registered unless otherwise specified by the customer. GM customer specific, March 2006, allows 2nd party audits "annually" however does not say anything about a plan to be certified?
Click to expand...
GM, when they are your customer, has the right to specify other requirements. If they are the only customer affected by a supplier, then the GM requirement supercedes the TS 16949 requirement.

jbGUERRA said:
Does this work for your auditors?:frust:
Click to expand...
It works for me, and I am one of the auditors...
 
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