Not sequentially following steps in a work instruction

Not sequentially following steps is an audit finding.

  • If there is evidence, "Yes" it's a finding

    Votes: 3 25.0%
  • Without more knowledge, I say "No", not a finding

    Votes: 1 8.3%
  • I would definitely dig deeper before any citation

    Votes: 8 66.7%
  • Given the limited information, no way to accurately say

    Votes: 3 25.0%

  • Total voters
    12

Paul Simpson

Trusted Information Resource
#81
I tried to use quotes in replying to Jim but his use of quotes turned it into a pile of poo, so I'll try from scratch.

IMHO if a particular method of operation is important then a work instruction is required. If it isn't it can be built from a print. So the example of use of gauges in Jim's example doesn't require a work instruction (again IMHO).

Similarly PPAP submission would not warrant a work instruction. The warrant and submission level define what is required and the APQP programme defines when the data are prepared - so why have a WI?
 
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Jim Wynne

Staff member
Admin
#82
Similarly PPAP submission would not warrant a work instruction. The warrant and submission level define what is required and the APQP programme defines when the data are prepared - so why have a WI?
How does a warrant define anything? Which (of possibly several) forms do you use for material test reports, dimensional reports, etc.? What information must those reports contain (which might be more than that called for in the PPAP manual)? How about the capability report? What format? Where does the data come from? Who signs the warrant and when? I could go on, but I assure you that there are no two companies that do PPAP the same, and if you don't have an work instruction you're asking for trouble.
 

Jim Wynne

Staff member
Admin
#83
IMHO if a particular method of operation is important then a work instruction is required. If it isn't it can be built from a print. So the example of use of gauges in Jim's example doesn't require a work instruction (again IMHO).
For purposes of this discussion, it doesn't make any difference if a WI is required or not. Perhaps the WI in question isn't necessary at all, but that doesn't alter the fact that it does exist.
 

Marc

Hunkered Down for the Duration with a Mask on...
Staff member
Admin
#85
While having good substance, this seems to have evolved into a fairly rough, contentious thread. The needling and off topic information must immediately cease.

Marc
 

Paul Simpson

Trusted Information Resource
#86
....... and if you don't have an work instruction you're asking for trouble.
A lot of the documents you mentioned are collected at stages of the APQP process and should be called up in APQP procedures for (for example) phase sign off and might reference the forms etc. required (e.g. to produce a capability report). Similarly authority levels (such as for sign off) are procedural activities.

Jim, if you believe PPAP warrants a WI then by all means produce one. I don't believe it gets on the radar.
 
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