Observations vs. Preventive Actions discovered during Audits

M

mshell

#11
We are talking internal. The things that we are issuing PARs will be an improvement to the QMS.
 
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RoxaneB

Super Moderator
Super Moderator
#12
Our Internal Audit Reports contain the following information breakdown:

Nonconformance Report

Will be a Nonconformance (minor) or Corrective Action (major) depending on the situation, the degree of nonconformity, and number of examples obtained during the audit. Must be resolved according.

Opportunities for Improvement

No nonconformity, but the Auditor, being that "extra set of eyes", sees a possible means by which the process may be improved. And OFI, once issued, can be either accepted or rejected by the Recipient based upon their documented analysis.

Notes

Suggestions of areas that the next group of auditors can look at, concerns noted during the audit (e.g., the auditees were unaware they were being audited that day) but no definite violation, etc.

Details

Audit question checklist responses, standard lingo of "Auditee was friendly and very helpful", and all the plus points that made the audit special.
 
#13
RCBeyette said:
Our Internal Audit Reports contain the following information breakdown:


Opportunities for Improvement

...once issued, can be either accepted or rejected by the Recipient based upon their documented analysis.
One thing I stress is that if an OFI is rejected, it is no big deal. The auditor saw something worth noting, and management considered it. The system worked. I am a little bit less enthusiastic when the OFI is ignored. To me, this shows part of the system is not working. You can either accept my suggestion, or reject it. But, please, don’t ignore it.
 

RoxaneB

Super Moderator
Super Moderator
#14
db said:
One thing I stress is that if an OFI is rejected, it is no big deal. The auditor saw something worth noting, and management considered it. The system worked. I am a little bit less enthusiastic when the OFI is ignored. To me, this shows part of the system is not working. You can either accept my suggestion, or reject it. But, please, don’t ignore it.
Bingo! :agree1: The analysis, upon which the OFI is accepted or rejected, must be approved by the Department Head (also a member of our Management Committee). All audit findings are brought to the attention of all Management Committee members.

If ignored, this will actually trigger one of my Key Indicators and everyone from the Supervisor level and up will know who the bad boy is. :D
 
#15
RCBeyette said:
If ignored, this will actually trigger one of my Key Indicators and everyone from the Supervisor level and up will know who the bad boy is.
Now, this brings up a question. If the OFI is ignored, is that (by itself) a nonconformance? :confused:
 
M

mshell

#16
That is basically the way that we are using the PAR with respect to observations. If the supplier deems that I have lost my mind and the PAR is not valid then they complete the PAR to say such. I review the response and agree or disagree. If we can not come to an understanding, Management members are brought in to resolve the dispute.


All of these items are then reviewed at Management Review.
 

RoxaneB

Super Moderator
Super Moderator
#17
db said:
Now, this brings up a question. If the OFI is ignored, is that (by itself) a nonconformance? :confused:
Yes and no. They have failed to address the OFI within the required time, but it doesn't take a rocket scientist to realize that if a Nonconformance Report is issued, they won't deal with that one, too.....so....

Round 1

Recipient receives an email from me during my month-end routine indicating they have not dealt with the OFI in a timely manner and requesting a status update.

Round 2

Due to the timing of our Operations Review meeting, the OFI discussed in Round 1 will not be closed by Operations Review....however, if it is updated, my numbers show that the OFI is beyond the accepted limit and an explanation as to why. Sometimes, things are outside of our control such as installing equipment...the contractor may not be available immediately.

Round 3

I check the status of the OFI at the Department's Key Indicator Meeting. If updated then...we're okay. If not updated, escalated to Round 4.

Round 4

Management Review (insert Darth Vader march.....here....). The offending OFI is brought to the attention of Senior Management, who open an Action Item up in their Log for the suitable Manager to deal with the OFI. If not updated by the next month, well, the meetings can get ugly....I bring complimentary bandaids...
 

RoxaneB

Super Moderator
Super Moderator
#19
The Taz! said:
I'm trying to picture you as either the James Earl Jones Darth Vader or the Rick Moranis Darth Helmut from Space Balls The Movie! :lmao: :lmao: :lmao: :lmao: :lmao: :lmao: :topic:
Thought you'd appreciate the reference...but I refuse to say which one is more appropriate!
 
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