OHSAS Lead Auditor Course - What do I need to know before taking this course?

somashekar

Staff member
Super Moderator
#11
I need professionals feedback regarding what do I need to know before taking this course? Any advice or professional help is appriciated. Thanks
When the OP is keen about Professional feedback / Advice, I take it that we must provide both general stuff about being open mind, enjoy the training, clean slate etc etc ..., along with specific stuff that he can brush through to be more aware and make the LA course interesting to him and be better prepared for the group discussion and exercises.
I am sure amanbhai has got both and would respond back after the LA course.
 
Elsmar Forum Sponsor

Paul Simpson

Trusted Information Resource
#12
I had assumed that folks would understand that I had delivered RABQSA and IRCA courses having been accepted by both of those organizations as a qualified trainer and that I was been speaking in very general terms. Sorry about the "assumption" because of how I must look to others...continuing on
My point was simply to draw a distinction between the learning outcomes from each of the accreditation course criteria. If you don't want to answer my point then just ignore it ... simple! :D

I'm not going to get drawn into the relative merits of the trainer approval process - another thread. Let's just say my experience of the quality of trainers indicates they follow the same 'normal' distribution as the auditor pool they are generally drawn from. Ranging between awful and excellent.


Also, IRCA only recommends, it doesn't mandate any understanding prior, and the training organization you identified at "random" doesn't mandate or require basic understanding either
The reason is it is a 'mandatory requirement' that is impossible to assess. My concern is that the vast majority of training providers do not even attempt to follow the spirit of the requirement so you end up with each lead auditor course starting with a very mixed level of knowledge of the management system standard and that means the knowledgeable students are held back while the trainer(s) desperately try and cram the respective ISO or (as in this case OHSAS) knowledge into the heads of the weaker students.

There is little enough time on the course to give knowledgeable students the grounding in auditing to the standard without spending half the course cramming.

We reap what we sow ... you only have to look around the threads here and elsewhere to see the customer view of the long tail of third party assessors.

Perhaps if these auditors had received a bit more training in auditing on their course they'd be better at it now? :)


I don't claim to be an expert and never will, but I kinda know a small bit about this subject and its evolution.
Now I'll have to erase from my mind all the posts you've made in the past that tell us everything you've done over your career ... and I'll then buy in to your new modest Randy persona. :)


Back on track...

I've (me, personally) I've historically found the best students to be those that come in with a clean slate so to speak.
Agreed. The training organization I ran had data that showed that the most successful students were female and straight out of college and the least successful were middle aged men with a wealth of knowledge in the particular field. I won't go into the analysis as to why - again that's another thread.


The point is not who is best placed to pass the exam but who makes the best auditor - in my mind both groups above provide a strong potential base.

So, Randy. If you do want to come back on my one point it is this:
  • Students on a lead auditor course should have a broad understanding of the management systems standard before they start

Or you could just have a pop and blow smoke up my a**.
 
A

amanbhai

#13
I had assumed that folks would understand that I had delivered RABQSA and IRCA courses having been accepted by both of those organizations as a qualified trainer and that I was been speaking in very general terms. Sorry about the "assumption" because of how I must look to others...continuing on

Also, IRCA only recommends, it doesn't mandate any understanding prior, and the training organization you identified at "random" doesn't mandate or require basic understanding either

I don't claim to be an expert and never will, but I kinda know a small bit about this subject and its evolution.

Back on track...

I've (me, personally) I've historically found the best students to be those that come in with a clean slate so to speak.
Back in 2005, I have taken a 5 day lead auditor course of ISO 9001. I remember Mr. Randy and he's right about what he just said.
 

Randy

Super Moderator
#14
Agreed. The training organization I ran had data that showed that the most successful students were female and straight out of college and the least successful were middle aged men with a wealth of knowledge in the particular field. I won't go into the analysis as to why - again that's another thread.


The point is not who is best placed to pass the exam but who makes the best auditor - in my mind both groups above provide a strong potential base.
This is gonna scare the doodles out of ya...I'm in total agreement:agree1: But you know what? I was severly chastised once for saying so:frust:

Nice comment about the smoke:lol: I love it when someone is honest.
 

Paul Simpson

Trusted Information Resource
#15
This is gonna scare the doodles out of ya...I'm in total agreement:agree1: But you know what? I was severly chastised once for saying so:frust:
Yes, I said another thread but as this seems to have quietened down I'll add some comments here.

By definition the statement is sexist (and ageist) but is based on some facts. The logic behind the two groups is my own opinion (and strictly in relation to the 5 day lead auditor course) and can therefore be ignored by anyone as just my 'best guess:
  • Females tend to be less 'arrogant' than males and are therefore more willing to learn :notme:
  • Younger people ar more used to high intensity learning and examnation and therefore cope better with the 5 day 'cram' that is a lead auditor course whereas older people have much more knowledge but are not as good at getting it out in a pressure situation :frust:

Nice comment about the smoke:lol: I love it when someone is honest.
Over the years, Randy, we have disagreed about plenty but rarely fallen out! :D
 
Thread starter Similar threads Forum Replies Date
A OHSAS 18001 external auditor finding personal interpretation? Occupational Health & Safety Management Standards 5
B Multi-site certification (IAF MD1) - for 9001, 14001, OHSAS/45001 ISO 14001:2015 Specific Discussions 16
Q Correspondence between ISO 14001:2015 & OHSAS 18001:2007 ISO 14001:2015 Specific Discussions 2
D I heard that there is no new version of ISO 18001 OHSAS after 2017 version Occupational Health & Safety Management Standards 3
R OHSAS 18001:2007 Section 3 - Controlling Work Place Risks Occupational Health & Safety Management Standards 3
x-files Naming convention: OHSMS or OHSAS Occupational Health & Safety Management Standards 13
S OHSAS 18001: 2007 Evaluation of Compliance Occupational Health & Safety Management Standards 7
D Key steps to OHSAS 18001 Implementation Other ISO and International Standards and European Regulations 1
drgnrider Is there a specific OHSAS 18001 sign format? Occupational Health & Safety Management Standards 4
S OHSAS 18001 - 4.3.2 Legal and Other Requirements - Working document or template Occupational Health & Safety Management Standards 2
Chennaiite Is Audit of Employee Canteen Food within the scope of OHSAS 18001? Occupational Health & Safety Management Standards 17
D Combined Quality Manual for ISO 9001, ISO 14001, ISO 50001 and OHSAS 18001 Document Control Systems, Procedures, Forms and Templates 11
S OHSAS 18001 Typical Input and Output Examples Occupational Health & Safety Management Standards 4
S OHSAS 18001 Gap Analysis Template wanted Occupational Health & Safety Management Standards 5
SATHYABALARAMAN OHSAS 18001:2007 4.4.1 Top management appointee Occupational Health & Safety Management Standards 8
M IMS - Integrated ISO9001, ISO14001 & OHSAS 18001 Internal Audit Checklist Internal Auditing 3
S How does each element of OHSAS contribute to management of work place safety & health Occupational Health & Safety Management Standards 7
L OHSAS 18001 Participation and Consultation - Incident investigation under 4.4.3.2 Occupational Health & Safety Management Standards 15
R Does "establish, implement and maintain a procedure" require a Document - OHSAS 18001 Occupational Health & Safety Management Standards 1
S Evaluation of legal compliance to ISO 14001 and OHSAS 18001 ISO 14001:2015 Specific Discussions 18
C OHSAS 18001 and a site visit - All our work is on client sites Occupational Health & Safety Management Standards 4
A R2 Certification vs Self Declaration to ISO 14001 and OHSAS 18001 ISO 14001:2015 Specific Discussions 3
D Integration of ISO 9001 and OHSAS 18001 - Management Manual Occupational Health & Safety Management Standards 5
R OHSAS 18001 & ISO 9001 Implementation - help! Process Maps, Process Mapping and Turtle Diagrams 7
K OHSAS 18001 Scope and Legal & Other Requirements Occupational Health & Safety Management Standards 3
Claes Gefvenberg Done... OHSAS 18001 registration Occupational Health & Safety Management Standards 9
A Multi-Site Certification to ISO 9001, 14001 and OHSAS 18001 ISO 9000, ISO 9001, and ISO 9004 Quality Management Systems Standards 10
P Separate procedures? ISO 14k System combined with OHSAS 18001 Occupational Health & Safety Management Standards 3
J What is Exposure Assessment Strategy - Annex D of OHSAS 18002? Occupational Health & Safety Management Standards 6
K Why is OHSAS 18001 not an ISO (IOS) Standard? Occupational Health & Safety Management Standards 8
D What is required in a combined ISO 9001, ISO 14001 and OHSAS 18001 Audit? ISO 9000, ISO 9001, and ISO 9004 Quality Management Systems Standards 8
B OHSAS 18001 - Requirements for Auditing Procedure Occupational Health & Safety Management Standards 17
C ISO 14001 and OHSAS 18001 Registrar Auditor Credentials Career and Occupation Discussions 8
K Auditing OHSAS 18001, ISO 9001 & ISO 14001 for 4 Business Units General Auditing Discussions 2
O Requirements under OHSAS 18001 for the Control of Risks Occupational Health & Safety Management Standards 8
T Procedures Cited in OHSAS 18001 Appendix Occupational Health & Safety Management Standards 4
N Does OHSAS 18001 require organization to have AED (Automatic External Defibrillator) Occupational Health & Safety Management Standards 4
S Company Structure for OHSAS Certification - Holding Company with Subsidaries Occupational Health & Safety Management Standards 5
S Airborne Survey Legal Compliance - OHSAS 18001 Occupational Health & Safety Management Standards 2
S Logo Marking for Marketing purpose - ISO 9001, ISO 14001 and OHSAS 18001 ISO 9000, ISO 9001, and ISO 9004 Quality Management Systems Standards 1
S OHSAS 18001 Safety Management System (SMS) Implementation Plan Occupational Health & Safety Management Standards 7
E Auditor wants to review our OHSAS 18001 Implementation Programme Occupational Health & Safety Management Standards 5
I ISO 14001 & OHSAS 18001 Questionnaire for Internal Auditor Certificate Other ISO and International Standards and European Regulations 2
S Building and Warehouse requirements of OHSAS 18001 Occupational Health & Safety Management Standards 8
P Risk Rating approaches (OHSAS 18001 - For Office Environments) Occupational Health & Safety Management Standards 6
V Internal Audit Material for OHSAS in ppt wanted Occupational Health & Safety Management Standards 0
P Scope Statement Content for OHSAS 18001 Occupational Health & Safety Management Standards 10
J OHSAS 18001 Clause 4.4.6 Operational Control Example Procedure Occupational Health & Safety Management Standards 9
W Project for our Risk Management class - OHSAS 18001 Help Occupational Health & Safety Management Standards 6
H Crossing from OHSAS 18001 to ILO OSH Occupational Health & Safety Management Standards 11

Similar threads

Top Bottom