One procedure or several? For "Developing Engineering"

[QAMTY]

Hi, all

In trying to clarify some doubts regarding procedures and processes

I´m working on developing some procedures and wi´s for a small Engineering company.

I´m considering the process as "Developing Engineering"
in the same way I´ll create "for purchasing", "for sales"

For developing Engineering:

As input, I consider, basic requirements, resources (skilled people, computers, standards) as activities, I consider the next: Numbering drawings, making the cross-checking, how to make the drawings, how to revise the drawing,etc

The final product is a drawing or a document.

am I right considering the next:

-The process = Developing Engineering and create one procedure for that process?
-Considering the activities as WI´S (numbering drawing, hot to make the cross-checking) (will be lot of wi´s)

Why the "make the cross-checking" activity can´t be a process?
since is an activity that receive inputs and produce outputs?

I´m confused in how many processes vs procedures should I have.


Could be the "Developing Engineering" process broken down into
other processes or sub-processes like: Revising drawings, making cross-checkings? and create procedures for them?

Is it recommended?

Other: Does each process always need a Procedure according to ISO?

Hope someone can help me to clarify it.

Maybe someone can share a process map for a case like this

Thanks

 

[Coury Ferguson]

Re: One procedure or severals? for Engineering

ISO9001:2008 has a requirement of 6 minimum, but don't limit yourself to those 6.

If you company feels that Purchasing is a critical part of the system, than a procedure would be needed.

 

[Marc]

Re: One procedure or severals? for Engineering

ISO9001:2008 has a requirement of 6 minimum<snip>

Six documented procedures.

 

[Big Jim]

Re: One procedure or severals? for Engineering

Six documented procedures.

More accurately, there are six items in the standard that require a written procedure. They are specific items. They can be combined in any way you want or any one item can be covered with more than one procedure. Most common seems to have one procedure for each. Also very common is to combine control of documents and records into one written procedure and to combine corrective and preventive actions.

As to how to handle design. My suggestion is to do it in one written procedure. It makes sense to keep the various elements of design together. I would also suggest that you develop a design checklist to aid in controlling design activity.

 

[harry]

For developing Engineering:

As input, I consider, basic requirements, resources (skilled people, computers, standards) as activities, I consider the next: Numbering drawings, making the cross-checking, how to make the drawings, how to revise the drawing,etc

The final product is a drawing or a document.

Isn't this design and development as provided for under clause 7.3? Why try to reinvent the wheel when you cannot come out with a better alternative? Honestly, the phrase 'developing engineering' doesn't sound right at all (not being rude but just an honest opinion)

 

[Pancho]

the phrase 'developing engineering' doesn't sound right at all (not being rude but just an honest opinion)

Harry, our OP's mother tongue is Spanish (MTY in his name is Monterrey, where I happen to be today and home to the best cabrito in the world, but I digress).

In English, the word "engineer" can be either a noun or a verb. In Spanish, the word "ingeniería" can only be a noun, and it means the work-product of an engineer. If you want to translate the verb "to engineer" into Spanish, you must say "desarrollar la ingeniería", hence our colleague's transliteration "developing engineering".

As you suggest, the best option may be "Design", or "Diseño" (nouns OR verbs in both languages). But in both English and Spanish, "engineering" denotes a bit more professionalism than "design".

 

[harry]

My apologies and thanks for the clarification.

 

[Sam4Quality]

Originally posted by QAMTY
Hi, all

In trying to clarify some doubts regarding procedures and processes

I´m working on developing some procedures and wi´s for a small Engineering company.

I´m considering the process as "Developing Engineering"
in the same way I´ll create "for purchasing", "for sales"

For developing Engineering:

As input, I consider, basic requirements, resources (skilled people, computers, standards) as activities, I consider the next: Numbering drawings, making the cross-checking, how to make the drawings, how to revise the drawing,etc

The final product is a drawing or a document.

am I right considering the next:

-The process = Developing Engineering and create one procedure for that process?
-Considering the activities as WI´S (numbering drawing, hot to make the cross-checking) (will be lot of wi´s)
Why the "make the cross-checking" activity can´t be a process?
since is an activity that receive inputs and produce outputs?

I´m confused in how many processes vs procedures should I have.

Could be the "Developing Engineering" process broken down into
other processes or sub-processes like: Revising drawings, making cross-checkings? and create procedures for them?

Is it recommended?

Other: Does each process always need a Procedure according to ISO?
Hope someone can help me to clarify it.
Maybe someone can share a process map for a case like this

Thanks

Firstly, to make your life easier, I recommend that you AVOID getting to involved (in terms of definition) with the words 'processes' and 'activities'. Many people, including me, have done that in the past and achieved no benefit out of it!

As you are planning to devise a procedure for 'Developing Engineering' (Design and Development), why not adopt the approach of the clause 7.3 (Design Planning, Design Input, Design Output, Review, Verification, Validation, Control and Amendments) and develop your procedure based on these sub-clauses? All of the above can be developed into just ONE procedure and done in systematic way. Further, you may develop WI's for 'number drawings, how to make drawings, how to revise drawings' etc.

Start with developing a flowchart/process map of the design and development process. You can find Design form examples here. I once downloaded a good sample process map, could'nt find the link, so am attaching that sample design and development Process Map for you. You may modify it to your requirements.

Your 'Other 'question has been answered above by others.

Ciao.

 

[QAMTY]

THanks to Harry, Panchobook, Sam4quality, Big JIm Marc and Coury

I appreciate your help.

all the info helped me too much.

Panchobook:

I fully agree with you for the cabrito (a little goat) to be understood by others in the forum, don´t forget the arrachera and guacamole
and a cold beer, specially now very hot, 43 centigrades