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Organization Chart Control and Quality Manual Integration

A

aqualpro

#1
I am looking for quality standards-acceptable alternatives to including the organization chart directly in our quality manual. Our organization chart changes frequently enough that I can issue the (signed off) quality manual today and it could (technically) be out of date as soon as next week if the org chart changes.:mad:

What alternatives are there to be able to keep the org chart up to date without having to reissue the whole quality manual when the org chart changes?:cool:
 
G

George Weiss

#2
Re: Quality Manual and Organization Chart

Tag the org chart as a seperate document with rev. # and date. Then the changes will not effect your company's QM. :agree1:
Put into your e-QM an e-LINK to the PDF of your current rev. org chart.
 
#3
Re: Quality Manual and Organization Chart

I am looking for quality standards-acceptable alternatives to including the organization chart directly in our quality manual. Our organization chart changes frequently enough that I can issue the (signed off) quality manual today and it could (technically) be out of date as soon as next week if the org chart changes.:mad:

What alternatives are there to be able to keep the org chart up to date without having to reissue the whole quality manual when the org chart changes?:cool:
You should put an hyperlink in your Quality Manual that points to your organization chart.
This last document could be then considered as a controlled one, subjecting it to approval, revision and communicated apart as per your document control procedure.
:bigwave:
 
J

JaneB

#4
I am looking for quality standards-acceptable alternatives to including the organization chart directly in our quality manual. Our organization chart changes frequently enough that I can issue the (signed off) quality manual today and it could (technically) be out of date as soon as next week if the org chart changes.:mad:

What alternatives are there to be able to keep the org chart up to date without having to reissue the whole quality manual when the org chart changes?:cool:
Yes, this can happen. I sometimes think that org charts go out of date as soon as (if not as/before) they're signed off for release!

Both prevous posters have given good advice: break it out of the manual and issue as a separate document. You can hyperlink if you use online documentation; either way, you can reference it from your quality manual, as eg 'The current organisation chart'. (Of course, make sure you control it).

PS: there's no actual requirement in the Standard for either an organisation chart OR (if you have one) for it to be in your quality manual. It does say you have to define responsibilities and authorities; it does say you have to control documents relevant to the quality system. HOW you do that is up to you.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
A

adickerson

#5
You can make your QMS Org Chart focused on Titles or Departments and not on the personnel. That way you have a basic outline for how things are organized without specifics that change frequently.
 

somashekar

Staff member
Super Moderator
#6
Yes, this can happen. I sometimes think that org charts go out of date as soon as (if not as/before) they're signed off for release!

Both prevous posters have given good advice: break it out of the manual and issue as a separate document. You can hyperlink if you use online documentation; either way, you can reference it from your quality manual, as eg 'The current organisation chart'. (Of course, make sure you control it).

PS: there's no actual requirement in the Standard for either an organisation chart OR (if you have one) for it to be in your quality manual. It does say you have to define responsibilities and authorities; it does say you have to control documents relevant to the quality system. HOW you do that is up to you.
There is your answer in the PS: from JaneB ...
Perhaps you have seen some typical examples of Org chart in quality manuals and believe that you need to include one. There is no requirement to link Org chart to Quality manual.
For your quick reference here is 4.2.2 concerning the quality manual from ISO 9001:2008
4.2.2 Quality manual
The organization shall establish and maintain a quality manual that includes
a) the scope of the quality management system, including details of and justification for any exclusions(see 1.2),
b) the documented procedures established for the quality management system, or reference to them, and
c) a description of the interaction between the processes of the quality management system.

Anything else is extra
 
B

baynoli

#7
Yes, this can happen. I sometimes think that org charts go out of date as soon as (if not as/before) they're signed off for release!

Both prevous posters have given good advice: break it out of the manual and issue as a separate document. You can hyperlink if you use online documentation; either way, you can reference it from your quality manual, as eg 'The current organisation chart'. (Of course, make sure you control it).

PS: there's no actual requirement in the Standard for either an organisation chart OR (if you have one) for it to be in your quality manual. It does say you have to define responsibilities and authorities; it does say you have to control documents relevant to the quality system. HOW you do that is up to you.
re:pS, in defining responsibilities and authorities it does not mean it should be in the quality manual or in the org chart right? and this can be also done in a separate form/document right? like Job Description.

Currently im working with our org chart, would like to know if its ok to reflect only the executives and managers level? Will I be questioned by auditors why i didnt include the lower level of managers? They might say below manager level are not part of the org since its not reflected in the chart? How would i response to this kind of question. :D:D really hate this kind of auditors...:argue:
 
A

adickerson

#8
Currently im working with our org chart, would like to know if its ok to reflect only the executives and managers level? Will I be questioned by auditors why i didnt include the lower level of managers?
If you have employee classes then it is easy to just org chart only particular classes. For example if you have managers as salary and line workers as hourly then you have a clear division. If some workers are management while others are union then you have another.

Avoiding these types of questions by an auditor can be as simple as having a description of what you are doing:

Org Chart
Senior Managers Only
 
T

tselalee

#9
Organization change is inevitble :argue:. A solution to cope with constant org chart changes would be to use an org chart software. :agree1: Check out humanconcepts org chart software to manage transition!
 

Stijloor

Staff member
Super Moderator
#10
Organization change is inevitable :argue:. A solution to cope with constant org chart changes would be to use an org chart software. :agree1: Check out humanconcepts org chart software to manage transition!
Are you in any way associated with the company that you recommended?

Stijloor, Forum Moderator.
 
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