GRISHAG

Inactive Registered Visitor
#1
We are going to relocate our production facility to new site which is located 6 km from existing one.
There will be no change in production equipment (which consists of equipment for sheet metal heat treatment and bending, punching and painting), methods, processes, materials (Aluminum and Titanium), manpower, measurement, etc.
Therefore, we don’t expect that relocation will affect conforming of our products to customer spec.
Please let me know, if in above mentioned situation we are obligated to perform FAI according to AS9102?
If the answer is “yes”, what are the criteria for choosing parts for FAI?
Thank you.
 

Michael_M

Quite Involved in Discussions
#2
Re: Plant relocation- is it necessary to perform FAI?

Unfortunatly I believe so. Per AS9102, 5.3 (item 2)
A change in manufacturing source(s), process(es), inspection method(s), location of manufacture, tooling or materials, that can potentially affect fit, form or function.
(Emphasis mine)
 

PaulJSmith

Quality Manager
#3
Re: Plant relocation- is it necessary to perform FAI?

I believe Michael is correct. If you move the equipment, you'll need to re-verify any parts made on it.
 

Mikishots

Quite Involved in Discussions
#4
We are going to relocate our production facility to new site which is located 6 km from existing one.
There will be no change in production equipment (which consists of equipment for sheet metal heat treatment and bending, punching and painting), methods, processes, materials (Aluminum and Titanium), manpower, measurement, etc.
Therefore, we don’t expect that relocation will affect conforming of our products to customer spec.
Please let me know, if in above mentioned situation we are obligated to perform FAI according to AS9102?
If the answer is “yes”, what are the criteria for choosing parts for FAI?
Thank you.
As already mentioned, it's plainly stated in AS9102 that it's required.

Choosing parts? That's simple, it's the first-off of any part you make at the new location. Moving location is a big deal and lots of work.
 

Michael_M

Quite Involved in Discussions
#5
As already mentioned, it's plainly stated in AS9102 that it's required.

Choosing parts? That's simple, it's the first-off of any part you make at the new location. Moving location is a big deal and lots of work.
I know this is what Mikishots meant, but I am going to add:

It is the requirement for customers who require FAIR's to the AS9102 standard.
 

Project Man

Quite Involved in Discussions
#6
I highly recommend installation qualification/operation qualification/process qualification. That's basically recording that the machines were installed correctly (IQ), everything operates as expected (OQ) and it can produce good parts (PQ). The last one would include FAIR and a capability analysis. When we moved our equipment we checked Ppk of the last 30pcs before moving the machine and then checked the Ppk of the first 30pcs after moving the machines.
It sounds like a lot but when you think about it it's probably just documenting what you're guys are already doing.
 

qualitypirate

Inactive Registered Visitor
#7
Not only is this part of AS9102, but I have also seen language in POs and Customer/Supplier Quality Requirements spelling out the need for an FAI if anything at all in the manufacturing process changes.
 

Mike S.

An Early 'Cover'
#9
This is not as much of a slam-dunk "yes" as you might think.....I know, I got burned on it once.

If I were your customer I would definitely want you to do a new FAI for your plant move.

But.....IAQG (and some suppliers) interprets this AS9102 requirement so that it is not so open and shut, which is why I think some customers add their own special text regarding FAI requirements.

From the IAQG website:

B3. Question:
If Manufacturing is moved from one location/facility to another, is a new FAI required?

B3. Response:
9102 - 5.3.2 states: A change in manufacturing source(s), process(es), inspection method(s), location of manufacture, tooling or materials, that can potentially affect fit, form or function. The key wording is "potentially affect fit, form or function". If you have good rationale supporting a position that the change doesn't "potentially affect fit, form or function" (and you can convince your customer) an updated FAI is not required. The move distance isn't a factor. Record the reason for Partial FAI on field No.14 of Form 1.

B4. Question:
In 5.3, there are conditions that require a new or partial FAI when a change occurs "that can potentially affect fit, form or function". How is this assessed?

B4. Response:
The only people able to evaluate these changes for "fit, form or function" are those knowing the product, the processes, the environment and knowing which problems occurred in the past (lessons learned). These people belong to the producer ("the organization" in 9100). You may also be influenced by your customer. Standards provide requirements but cannot provide methods for meeting the requirements. The organization should have a process to determine who is responsible for addressing events requiring an updated FAI.
 

dsanabria

Quite Involved in Discussions
#10
We are going to relocate our production facility to new site which is located 6 km from existing one.
There will be no change in production equipment (which consists of equipment for sheet metal heat treatment and bending, punching and painting), methods, processes, materials (Aluminum and Titanium), manpower, measurement, etc.
Therefore, we don?t expect that relocation will affect conforming of our products to customer spec.
Please let me know, if in above mentioned situation we are obligated to perform FAI according to AS9102?
If the answer is ?yes?, what are the criteria for choosing parts for FAI?
Thank you.
First thing you need to do is to contact your customers and find out their requirements.

If they invoke AS9102 turn around and propose a Gage R & R (Gage repeatability and reproducibility) on the equipment in the new facility.

or

Ask them if they would accept a "Delta" (partial) F.A.I.R. on key or critical characteristics as per agreement.

or

Ask them if they would accept "Family" (identical dimensions) inspections. Meaning, if I have 20 parts that have the same outside diameter but different feature the you only have to do a partial inspection on one affected parts and accept the others based on the fact that the same dimension will perform the same tasks.

Finally

If you want to go to town the read:

http://www.iaqg.org/scmh - chapter 7.1 Work Transfer Management.
 
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