PPAP including FAI Parts - Customer is requiring 5000 measurements

A

asjahmed

#11
Since you reported 20 cavities on the die, I'm assuming the parts are small. If so, I'm surprised there are so many toleranced dimensions on the print. Perhaps some of these are REF, unilateral (MIN nn or MAX nn), or BASIC dimensions? Do you have a note on the print stating UNTOLERANCED DIMENSIONS ARE BASIC? If none of the above holds true, your design group has done a tremendous disservice to you.

As you know, you shouldn't have to measure reference or basic dimensions, and attribute data should suffice for unilateral dimensions.
 
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T

TShepherd

#12
Good advice to start with from the previous 2 posts.

I have done this a few times with success - Typically you'll need to put "conforms" on the layout where the tolerance goes and indicate Pass or fail - however, I would not send the data if it failed.

:)
 
D

dwlmson73

#13
Since you reported 20 cavities on the die, I'm assuming the parts are small. If so, I'm surprised there are so many toleranced dimensions on the print. Perhaps some of these are REF, unilateral (MIN nn or MAX nn), or BASIC dimensions? Do you have a note on the print stating UNTOLERANCED DIMENSIONS ARE BASIC? If none of the above holds true, your design group has done a tremendous disservice to you.

As you know, you shouldn't have to measure reference or basic dimensions, and attribute data should suffice for unilateral dimensions.
In reviewing some of our customers prints with basic dimensions, the same basic dimesion is tied to a GD&T feature. For example, true position. You have to measure these basic dimensions, even though the do not have a direct tolerance, becsue they are directly tied to the true position requirement.

My 2 cents worth
 
S

sky66666

#14
Finally, did you measure 2000 datas? i guess YES. you can add cost of PPAP into quoted price,but if your cost is more expensiver than other supplier,why do we choose yours. Anyway,2000 datas is need
 
M

Mr.Happy

#15
First of all I want to thank all of you for your support and advice.

In meantime I had lots of discussions with our customer and also with my boss over this item.
In the end we came to to an agreement to measure 20 parts 5 dimensions 5 times, so 500 measurements total.
Because I was so consistent in this, didn't make me very popular and also let to more disagreements with my boss.:frust:

From now on we* will review new parts better and make quality agreements for each new part.

*where I wrote "we" I mean "they" because I have a new job in the meantime.:lol:

Again thanks you all and I wish you a happy New Year.

Mr.Happy
 
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