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Product Audit - TS 16949 Clause 8.2.2.3

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#12
How did you get to PPAP from this TS requirement? I don't see it.

It used to be called "dock audit" in QS 9000 days, and we treat it as that even today. We pull a lot off the truck and have at it.

It turns out I have full text versions of TS and QS on my home computer so now I will log off and go drink heavily, because it is very clearly time for me to get a life!

Cheers

Caster


Bad OLD Discredited QS 9000 Version

Final Product Audit - 4.10.4.2
The supplier shall conduct audits of packaged final product to verify conformance to all specified requirements (e.g. product, packaging, labeling) at an appropriate frequency.

NOTE: This activity, also known as a "dock audit", is based upon sampling and is generally performed after final inspection but prior to shipment. Where customer PPM requirements are met, the frequency of Final Product Audits may be reduced.

New Improved Way Better TS 16949 Version

8.2.2.3 Product audit
The organization shall audit products at appropriate stages of production and delivery to verify conformity to all specified requirements, such as product dimensions, functionality, packaging and labeling, at a defined frequency.
Not all organizations can get away with just doing a 'dock audit'. It isn't really the intent anyway. I have heard that doing only dock audits has resulted in NC's for not doing them at 'appropriate stages of production'.........
 
S

SilverHawk

#13
The SMMT March 2007 newsletter explained the best part of the Product Audit. There are still many good people think that product audits are to be conduct / carry out by QC Inspectors. Most importantly, we cannot reach the clause 8.2.2.3 as it stand-alone on it own but to read in totality with the whole clause 8.2.2.
 

Raffy

Quite Involved in Discussions
#14
The attachment provided by Howard was very informative. I was totally enlightened with that attachment, because I don’t have the luxury of a formal training in TS16949, that’s why I’m trying my best reading a lot of information about ISO/TS16949, even source out books locally and international, just to abreast with the latest information about TS16949.
Thank you very much Howard for sharing the attachment.:thanx:
Best regards,
Raffy:cool:
 
S

Sharon_Noble

#16
We have continued with our Dock Audits, even after the death of QS, however the dock audit doesn't really cover the part of the clause "at appropriate stages of production" We now have product audits incorporated into our production process. The "First Off" produced on a line is subject to an audit by an independant person (usually Supervisor, QA Inspector, or other designated associate) A document follows the product through all processes and on it is recorded conformance/non-conformance to specified requirements. If there is a non-conformance, the production line is stopped until appropriate corrective actions have taken place. The document is used to record the NC, the action, the persons with authority to implement the action, the date of the actions, and then the re-audit to requirements. This sounds like a big thing but actually it could be as small as:

The product label was smudged in process and therefore unreadable

1) Note on form "Label is not readable" Stop process and notify Supervisor
2) If there is an issue with all labels then they are segregated and scrapped and new ones are produced and reviewed for acceptance.
3) New process of creating labels only when product is ready to be cased is implimented. (not days before and sitting around) "Preventative Action"
4) Actions taken noted on form and dated, with supervisors signature. "Authorization"
5) New labels attached, then "First Off" re-audited again to specifications.
6) Note that product now meets specifications, and form is filed with Quality Dept. "Close the Loop"

These are then reviewed as input to continuous improvements, preventative actions, even additional resources or machinary maintanance needed.

We have reduced our Dock Audits (1 shipment/week) based on declining #s of customer complaints but increases our "Product Audits" based on internal compliants. (NCs caught in process)
Since changing our process we have been able to catch alot of "little" issues that would not cause our Customer to create a formal complaint, but over time would probably p*ss them off. We are now able to catch these issues, deal with them immediately, so the next time the product is built we know there wont be any issues.

We also conduct Annual Layouts as required but I don't believe that these could be considered Product Audits as they are, like Dock Audits, not "at appropriate stages of production".
 

Raffy

Quite Involved in Discussions
#17
Hi ayfergoymen,
In our end, our product audit instruction was incorporated in our Internal Audit Procedure. We create a form to determine what
are the criteria that we should cover.
There are product audit sample available in this forum, all you have to do is browse and search.
Remember...patience is a virtue.
Raffy

hello I need to write a final product audit instruction.Could you please give a sample ?
thanks
 

howste

Thaumaturge
Super Moderator
#18
hello I need to write a final product audit instruction.Could you please give a sample ?
thanks
If you look at the top of the page there is a green "Post Attachments List" button. It indexes all of the various documents that users have posted over the years. Here's a list of documents that come up with a quick search for "product audit."

http://elsmar.com/Forums/fileslist....tby=filename&pageamt=2&criteria=product+audit

Hopefully one or more of these may be useful to you.
 
K

KayBee4

#19
Wouldn't using your Control Plan as a check sheet work and align well as a product audit? As opposed to trying to come up with something else?

Maybe I'm oversimplifying the Product Audit process?
Curious if anyone else takes that approach,. - Thanks, KB
 
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