QMS (Quality Management System) Manual - The Boss Wants a 4 Page Manual - What to Do?

[Howard Atkins]

Please can you moderate your tone
There is no need to be offensive.
Please respect other peoples attitude as you wish them to respect yours.

 

[Rob Nix]

Mr. Fast One,

Please keep in mind that there is a wide variety of folks visiting this forum, from "newbies" just starting out (or thrown into a "quality" position) to extremely knowledgeable and experienced people with as much or more credibility than yourself. Most of the veterans from this site kindly assist the newer ones in such a way that they maintain their dignity.

If there is something specific that you feel is "drivel", please expalin what that is, and your better alternative. In thay way each of us will benefit from your knowledge.

You seem to have a lot of disdain for Quality practitioners, yet your profile says you are a Quality Manager yourself. Hmmm? At least you were honest in the "introductions" thread where you stated that something that sets you apart from the rest is being "self-obsessed" and "arrogant".

Common sense tells us that professionals have more success when they avoid berating their peers. I don't want to argue, just please, keep your comments respectful. Thanks.

 

[The Fast One]

Mr. Fast One,

Please keep in mind that there is a wide variety of folks visiting this forum, from "newbies" just starting out (or thrown into a "quality" position) to extremely knowledgeable and experienced people with as much or more credibility than yourself. Most of the veterans from this site kindly assist the newer ones in such a way that they maintain their dignity.

If there is something specific that you feel is "drivel", please expalin what that is, and your better alternative. In thay way each of us will benefit from your knowledge.

You seem to have a lot of disdain for Quality practitioners, yet your profile says you are a Quality Manager yourself. Hmmm? At least you were honest in the "introductions" thread where you stated that something that sets you apart from the rest is being "self-obsessed" and "arrogant".

Common sense tells us that professionals have more success when they avoid berating their peers. I don't want to argue, just please, keep your comments respectful. Thanks.

It's not "Mr", it's "The".......

 

[db]

....but then, if common sense prevailed there wouldn't be any of this nonsense and none of you would have 'Quality' jobs, I wonder if there is a connection.....?

Of course this is just the assumption that the lack of common sense is the only cause of process variation. Sometimes "exact knowledge", or certain experience is what is necessary to solve quality issues. Even if everyone used "common sense", I think my job would still be quite secure.

 

[surendro - 2009]

No, it is not the correct way. Quality Manual is a kind of directive from the Top Management about the way the company has to function. This is, however, subject to the dictats of the ISO 9001:2000 Standards. Therefore, such brevity won't help the working of the organisation adopting it.

 

[db]

No, it is not the correct way. Quality Manual is a kind of directive from the Top Management about the way the company has to function. This is, however, subject to the dictats of the ISO 9001:2000 Standards. Therefore, such brevity won't help the working of the organisation adopting it.

Very good point! You make two distinctions that most folks don't see. One is the "why" of the Quality Manual. As you say it "is a kind of directive from Top Management about the way the company has to function." The Quality Manual sets the direction of the organization and its QMS. There is also the "what" of the Quality Manual. The standard has specific requirements. I can write a one-page quality manual that meets the technical specifications of the standard, but it could very well be functionally useless. On the other hand I could write a Quality Manual that is just what the organization needs, but still might not meet the standard.

 

[The Fast One]

Of course this is just the assumption that the lack of common sense is the only cause of process variation. Sometimes "exact knowledge", or certain experience is what is necessary to solve quality issues. Even if everyone used "common sense", I think my job would still be quite secure.

No assumptions, just facts that must be considered within the design and design actions taken to stop them happening. Unfortunately with this 'theory' goes the unwritten 'Quality' rule that this type of work is not primary to the design but is secondary, hence 'Quality practioners' who must perform these activities, so giving no positive value to the customer, therefore, yes, your job is secure....

 

[db]

No assumptions, just facts that must be considered within the design and design actions taken to stop them happening. Unfortunately with this 'theory' goes the unwritten 'Quality' rule that this type of work is not primary to the design but is secondary, hence 'Quality practioners' who must perform these activities, so giving no positive value to the customer, therefore, yes, your job is secure....

Interesting..... There is no way you can design all of the variation out of a process. The FMEA process can identify some of the potential issues, but even then, I doubt many final RPNs will come out a "1". So, it is inevitable that nonconforming product will be created. When we add in the human influence (process operators/management) into the process....

In a perfect world (academia), it would be possible to eliminate the need for quality departments and functions. However, I’ve been around long enough to know we will never get close to that perfect world. There are too many sources of variation available. Now, not being specifically “trained” in quality, I do not know what the “unwritten Quality rule” is. I do know that while “quality” functions are not value added, neither is payroll, and janitorial services. But if people don’t get paid, the toilets don’t flush, and the customers leave because of quality issues, all value added functions cease.

 

[Mike S.]

I think Fast just wants to pick a fight out of boredom.

 

[Randy Stewart]

Hey Mike & db, Fast One sounds a bit like another member from across the big pond. Can you say Nosmo King????