QMS (Quality Management System) Manual - The Boss Wants a 4 Page Manual - What to Do?

[SAGHIR AHMED]

Re: QMS (Quality Management System) Manual - The Boss Wants a 4 Page Manual - What to

i CAN SECOND YOUR WORDS.

Helmut and AndyN, I understand your point and I don't disagree. But allow me to suggest that part of the reason for the lack of respect that you note is that many of our quality colleagues have been creating non-value-added documents such as 40 page quality manuals. This thread may be helpful to these folks which, in turn, may contribute to increasing management's respect for the position.

Ashwani did a good job of detailing the minimum one needs to have in a Quality Manual to pass third party audits. I use a 2-page "QMS Map" (sorry Helmut) that serves as a graphical representation and interface to the organization's management system, its process, and its documentation. Page one is basically a key to the various colors and symbols that I use and the location for any exclusion. Page 2 is where all of the action happens. In my experience, senior managers have been delighted by this approach and have been generally more receptive to listen to my other business improvement ideas. Auditors from the leading registrars have had only positive comments too.

 

[AndyN]

Re: QMS (Quality Management System) Manual - The Boss Wants a 4 Page Manual - What to

There will always be some disagreement about manual length, style and format, but there should never be any question about its content....

"The organization shall establish and maintain a quality manual that includes

a) the scope of the quality management system, including detail of and justification of any exclusions,
b) the documented procedures established for the quality management system, or reference to them, and
c) a description of the interaction between the processes of the quality management system." ........

It is hard to see how you can effectively deal with the subject matter in four pages.

Good luck,

Ralph

Take a look at this..........http://elsmar.com/Forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=4295&d=1132887869

 

[CliffK]

Re: QMS (Quality Management System) Manual - The Boss Wants a 4 Page Manual - What to

Current Quality Manual that is used in our organization is 18 pages long and meets the requirements of ISO 9001:2000 according to our registrar DNV. In addition, we have the required six procedures, forty four work instructions (identified as needed), and fifty seven forms that rounds out the Quality Management System documentation.

There will always be some disagreement about manual length, style and format, but there should never be any question about its content....

"The organization shall establish and maintain a quality manual that includes

a) the scope of the quality management system, including detail of and justification of any exclusions,
b) the documented procedures established for the quality management system, or reference to them, and
c) a description of the interaction between the processes of the quality management system." ........

No disagreement there.

It is hard to see how you can effectively deal with the subject matter in four pages.

Guess it depends on one's definition of "effectively."

Use of:

• imagination,
• economy of language,
• plain English vs. quality jargon and
• active voice

would trim a lot of quality manuals.

 

[kirilll]

Re: QMS (Quality Management System) Manual - The Boss Wants a 4 Page Manual - What to

I have worked with DNV and countless other registrars that have been very happy with the QMS Map approach that I use. I would give you a link, but I don't think this is allowed here.

ADMIN NOTE: This forum is not for advertising. Were kirilll interested in participating, rather than advertising his service, he would share here with us rather than just refer us to his web site.

kirilll: Please stop posting self advertisements.

Thank you.

 

[JaneB]

Re: QMS (Quality Management System) Manual - The Boss Wants a 4 Page Manual - What to

Boscoeee

No argument about the content - we've read the relevant clause too.

But here, I do argue with you:

It is hard to see how you can effectively deal with the subject matter in four pages.

One answer to it being 'hard' is to adopt a broader perspective, gain more experience in the Standard and learn that it can - and must be- applicable to many, many different kinds of organisations in many, many different fields, and of all kindsof sizes, from 1-2 people businesses right up to global corporations. There isn't any such thing as 'one size fits all'.

4 pages? Yes, it can be done. It has been done. THere are examples in the forum.

But as this and other threads point out, size (number of pages) is quite immaterial. (Although I too strongly favour the less the better approach - anything over what is absolutely necessary for an individual company is too much).

But '4 pages' is a good provocative title - if nothing else, it sure stimulates debate and gets people seriously thinking!

(See, Helmut, it just won't die... you'll have to unsub from this thread)

 

[JaneB]

Re: QMS (Quality Management System) Manual - The Boss Wants a 4 Page Manual - What to

Ralph,

I would give you a link, but I don't think this is allowed here.

Really? I've seen plenty of links to external sites... what's the problem?

 

[Wes Bucey]

Liks - allowed/not allowed - which?

Really? I've seen plenty of links to external sites... what's the problem?

Just a clarification here.

1. Material for which the Cove member has right and authority to release may be uploaded to the Cove, but doing so essentially puts it in the public domain. We therefore caution folks who are trying to sell such material to avoid future rancor by NOT posting.
2. Links to free material provided by any organization "may" be allowed. (Moderators sometimes pull such links, but will give an explanation in such cases.)
3. Links to free material provided by a Cove member "may" be allowed. (Moderators sometimes pull such links, but will give an explanation in such cases.)
4. Links to material sold by Cove members are allowed on a case-by-case basis - ALWAYS ask Marc for a ruling first.
5. Links to material sold by public organizations (ASQ, ISO, BSI, etc.) are allowed, but the person posting such link MUST disclose any connection [or lack of connection] to the organization.

In general, we do not allow overt or "stealth" advertising within a post. Posters may have contact information in their Profile and refer to such within a post. Posters who continually refer to their services being available via a link in their Profile, but who do not provide meaningful help or comment within their posts may be cautioned by moderators and extreme cases may have posts deleted by the moderators.

If you have any further questions on this matter, please start a thread in the Elsmar Cove Forum TOS, Policies and Procedures Forum.

 

[kirilll]

Re: QMS (Quality Management System) Manual - The Boss Wants a 4 Page Manual - What to

Jane & Wes,

Thanks for the comments and clarifications.

When I first joined the Cove I made the mistake of providing links to my site and was admonished of it. As you can immagine I use my site both to inform and to drive business so I did not want to come off as overtly or covertly using my post to advertize. I also don't have enough post to allow me to include a link.

*** removed company website information *** contact information is available in user profile

 

[kdsaggi]

Re: QMS (Quality Management System) Manual - The Boss Wants a 4 Page Manual - What to

Thanks

While you upload any document of your company, please remove your company name/personnel names in your document.

Your company may be taken action on you for shearing company info to others.


Regards

 

[JaneB]

Re: Liks - allowed/not allowed - which?

Actually, I assumed that all the relevant rules & requirements would be complied with - but good clarification in any case, Wes.

In general, we do not allow overt or "stealth" advertising within a post.

Good heavens, no.