QS-9000 Clause 4.2.3.2 - Special Characteristics on process flow diagrams

D

Dave

#1
#1
Special characteristics

We were recently cited during an internal audit for not showing "special characteristics" on our process flow diagrams. ISO/QS 9000, section 4.2.3.2, states that they must be shown on "process control guidelines and similar documents" and gives FMEA,s, Control Plans and Operator Instructions as examples. Process Flow Diagrams are not mentioned. We are going to challenge the auditor on this one, anyone have any input?

Thanks,
 
Elsmar Forum Sponsor
A

Al Dyer

#2
#2
Dave:

Was it a true internal audit you performed,or an audit from a registrar?

If from a registrar was it a major or a minor?

I ask because issues like these should have been cleared up at a desk (document) audit or a pre-assessment.

Is the process flow chart a process control guideline? I would think so if you define it as such.

Do I believe that special characteristics should be on the process flow? Yes, even if it not used to control the process.

Do you define in your procedures or work instructions that the process flow is used to control the process?

If yes, you have a situation.

If no, I see no place in the QS9000 manual or the AIAG PPAP manual that says you are required to use the process flow chart to control the process (intent is another issue). If you havn't already done so I would ask the auditor where it is defined that the flow charts have to be used to control the process.

If you have to take the hit, I don't see it a major issue, just a document replacement hassle.

As an auditor I would be more worried about control plans and operator inspection instruction displaying the special characteristic.

ASD...
 
Howard Atkins

Howard Atkins

Forum Administrator
Staff member
Admin
#3
#3
According to the APQP handbook 3.3 Flow chart is an aid, as far as I can see there is no explanation as how it must be completed and Appendix A-6 does not mention special characteristics. I agree that they should be there as the flow chart is an aid to build the control plan and them being mentioned insures that you will relate to them. This could be a hit under mistake proofing but as for special characteristics IMHO no.
 
S

Sam

#4
#4
You do not state what the purpose of your flow chart is in the process.
If it is an operator instruction, then yes you have to show special characteristics.
 
T

T.P.NAMASIVAYAM

#5
#5
I feel the "Special Characteristics" has to be mentioned in the Process flow diagrams.
The reason for doing so is :
When the Process is subjected to change for any process improvements or value analysis, the identification of special characteristics on the process flow diagram will alert the engineer, that particular process is producing a special characteristics and care has to be taken in modifying the process.
Originally posted by Dave:
We were recently cited during an internal audit for not showing "special characteristics" on our process flow diagrams. ISO/QS 9000, section 4.2.3.2, states that they must be shown on "process control guidelines and similar documents" and gives FMEA,s, Control Plans and Operator Instructions as examples. Process Flow Diagrams are not mentioned. We are going to challenge the auditor on this one, anyone have any input?

Thanks,
Click to expand...
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Thread starter Similar threads Forum Replies Date
R QS-9000 Clause 4.2.5.1 Continuous Improvement of Product Special Characterisitics Preventive Action and Continuous Improvement 4
sathis Is Master Sample a Document? - ISO 9000:2000, Clause 3.7.2 ISO 9000, ISO 9001, and ISO 9004 Quality Management Systems Standards 32
J New TL 9000 Released - Can Exclude more than Clause 7 Various Other Specifications, Standards, and related Requirements 0
M ISO 9001 Clause 7.5 vs. QS-9000 Sections 4.10 & 4.19? ISO 9000, ISO 9001, and ISO 9004 Quality Management Systems Standards 4
C QS-9000 Clause 8.5.3 - Preventive Action - How Can I Improve My Weak System? IATF 16949 - Automotive Quality Systems Standard 12
C ISO 9000 Clause 6.2.2 - Competence - Compiling a list of required competencies ISO 9000, ISO 9001, and ISO 9004 Quality Management Systems Standards 80
L QS-9000 Clause 4.19.1 - Feedback of Information from Service QS-9000 - American Automotive Manufacturers Standard 6
A ISO 9000 Clause 4.2.2 - Interactions Between Processes - How do you satisfy this? ISO 9000, ISO 9001, and ISO 9004 Quality Management Systems Standards 25
A Corrective Actions - ISO 9001:2000 vs. QS-9000 Clause 4.14 IATF 16949 - Automotive Quality Systems Standard 7
C QS-9000 Clause 7.3.7 - Design Changes - How is this interpreted? Design and Development of Products and Processes 7
A ISO 9000:2000 Clause 8.3 - Control of Non-Conforming Product Nonconformance and Corrective Action 7
A QS-9000 Clause 4.6.2.1 and Interpretation C9 - Subcontractor Development QS-9000 - American Automotive Manufacturers Standard 41
K TS 16949 Clause 7.4.1.2 - Supplier Development and ISO 9000 Registration Requirement Supplier Quality Assurance and other Supplier Issues 22
N Final Product Audits - What happened to QS-9000 Clause 4.10.4.2? IATF 16949 - Automotive Quality Systems Standard 9
S QS-9000 Clause 4.10.4.2 - Final Product Audit vs. Dock Audit QS-9000 - American Automotive Manufacturers Standard 6
C QS 9000 third edition clause 4.9.g.1 - Seeking an example SOP QS-9000 - American Automotive Manufacturers Standard 3
J QS-9000 Clause 4.11.2.b.1 - Calibration by OEM vs. Accredited Laboratory QS-9000 - American Automotive Manufacturers Standard 6
A ISO 9000:2000 Clause 7.3 Design and Development Requirements Summary Design and Development of Products and Processes 23
F QS-9000 Clause 4.9.g.1 - Preventive Maintenance - Tool Wear Predictive Maintenance QS-9000 - American Automotive Manufacturers Standard 1
P QS-9000 Clause 4.2.5 - Prioritized Action Plans Preventive Action and Continuous Improvement 9
C TL-9000 Certifying Body Issue - Auditor failed to find an issue for 10 years TL 9000 Telecommunications Standard and QuEST 16
Q Choosing between ISO 9001 (2015) & TL 9000 certifications ISO 9000, ISO 9001, and ISO 9004 Quality Management Systems Standards 4
qualprod In ISO 9000, Standard vocabulary - Competitors , interested parties? ISO 9000, ISO 9001, and ISO 9004 Quality Management Systems Standards 13
A Happy 30th Birthday, ISO 9000! ISO 9000, ISO 9001, and ISO 9004 Quality Management Systems Standards 1
A ISO 9000 Standard "standard" definition ISO 9000, ISO 9001, and ISO 9004 Quality Management Systems Standards 6
M What is the difference between ISO 9000 and ISO 9001? ISO 9000, ISO 9001, and ISO 9004 Quality Management Systems Standards 2
J QS 9000 Internal Audit Booklet required Internal Auditing 2
Q TL 9000 Measurement Requirements TL 9000 Telecommunications Standard and QuEST 3
Q TL 9000 8.4.V.1 Quality Manual in a Service Company Service Industry Specific Topics 3
T Where to purchase ISO 9001:2008 and ISO 9000:2005? ISO 9000, ISO 9001, and ISO 9004 Quality Management Systems Standards 2
W QS 9000 to TS 16949 Transition Questions IATF 16949 - Automotive Quality Systems Standard 1
M ISO 9000 World Conference and Draft changes to new revision ISO 9000, ISO 9001, and ISO 9004 Quality Management Systems Standards 2
Q Moving steps from ISO 9001 to TL 9000 TL 9000 Telecommunications Standard and QuEST 4
I ISO 9000 series, 13485:2003, 15378:2006 - Small Compounding Pharmacy ISO 9000, ISO 9001, and ISO 9004 Quality Management Systems Standards 2
S TL 9000 Certified Companies - REMINDER - TL 5.0 Measurements Effectivity - July 2013 TL 9000 Telecommunications Standard and QuEST 1
O ISO 9000 section 7.2.1(c) Compliance help needed ISO 9000, ISO 9001, and ISO 9004 Quality Management Systems Standards 5
A Exploding the Myths Surrounding ISO 9000: A Practical Implementation Guide Book, Video, Blog and Web Site Reviews and Recommendations 28
Q How to correlate the 8 Quality Management Principles to ISO 9000 standards ? ISO 9000, ISO 9001, and ISO 9004 Quality Management Systems Standards 3
A Quality Software TQS-9000 Family of Products Quality Manager and Management Related Issues 3
R Is ISO 9001 a prerequisite to TL 9000 certification? TL 9000 Telecommunications Standard and QuEST 5
optomist1 ISO 9001 vs TL 9000 - Looking for a comparison matrix Other ISO and International Standards and European Regulations 3
Q ISO 9000 Conference Istanbul-Turkey - Looking for Speakers ISO 9000, ISO 9001, and ISO 9004 Quality Management Systems Standards 1
S New to ISO/TS16949 - Our QS-9000 certification has expired IATF 16949 - Automotive Quality Systems Standard 3
D TL 9000 Lead Auditor Training & Certification TL 9000 Telecommunications Standard and QuEST 1
M PS 9000:2001 significance ISO 9000, ISO 9001, and ISO 9004 Quality Management Systems Standards 2
M PS 9000: 2001 - What are the Salient Features Various Other Specifications, Standards, and related Requirements 4
Project Man What is the most current ISO 9000 standard? I heard there is an ISO 9100 ISO 9000, ISO 9001, and ISO 9004 Quality Management Systems Standards 9
M "ISO 9000 Quality Systems Handbook" by David Hoyle Book, Video, Blog and Web Site Reviews and Recommendations 24
N How does a company determine what ISO standard (9000 or 9001) to register to? ISO 9000, ISO 9001, and ISO 9004 Quality Management Systems Standards 7
Q Full Job Description and Responsibilities in ISO 9000? ISO 9000, ISO 9001, and ISO 9004 Quality Management Systems Standards 12

Similar threads

Top Bottom