QS-9000 vs. ISO 9001:2000 - Which Should We Persue?

Raffy

Quite Involved in Discussions
QS9000 Vs. ISO9001:2000

One of our supplier is requiring us to be QS9000 certified. I know for a fact that this is officially obsoleted by ISO/TS16949:2002. We are currently certified to the old standard of ISO, we haven't made our upgrade yet for ISO9001:2000 and were planning to do it this year. My question is since we are required by the customer to do QS9000, is it beneficial and economical for the company to go for QS9000? instead of TS16949 :frust: and how about ISO9001:2000, does it cover some clauses on the QS9000? :confused:

Thanks in advance.

Best regards,
Raffy
 
R

Randy Stewart

Why QS?

Raffy,
Are you a Tier 1 supplier? If not, you are only required to be compliant with ISO 9001. IMO it is a little late in the game to be required to obtain registration to an outdated standard. Just my opinion. I would question the reasoning behind the requirement.
 
R

Russ

Raffy,
Keep in mind that if you proceed with both updating to ISO 9001:2000 and QS 9000 you will have to have two seperate certificates. This will also require two seperate first tier quality manuals. Neither can reference the other. Not a problem from there on down. Makes the internal auditing a little more complicated too by having to keep track of two systems. But it can be done, we are doing it.
 

Raffy

Quite Involved in Discussions
Hi Randy,

Now I'm confused. :confused: :frust: I don't know what a Tier 1 Supplier mean? Sorry. It would be a bit late to be certified in QS9000, but our supplier said that TS16949 has a big difference against QS9000. :(

Where could I find or reference that if we are not a Tier 1 Supplier, we are required only to be compliant with ISO9001? Please advice.

Hi Russ,
Thank you for reminding, after I post this question, I search some forums on updating and your right, it was indeed two separate certificates. Two separate quality manuals, hmmm...lots of work for us...

Thanks a lot.
Best regards,
Raffy
 
R

Randy Stewart

Tier 1's

Raffy,
A tier 1 supplier delivers parts directly to an OEM assembly plant. A tier 2 would supply component parts to the Tier 1's. Review the Sanctioned Interpretations to QS for a better understanding of what is required as a "subcontractor" or Tier 2.
 

Raffy

Quite Involved in Discussions
Hi Randy,
I already read the QS9000 3rd Edition (1998). However, I had some more concerns. And based from that sanctions, "There is no requirement for the Second Tier Suppliers to be registered to QS9000."

Was this a requirement for QS9000 alone? How about TS1649:2002, is it a requirement that all suppliers must be TS/QS Certified? :confused:

Thanks in advance.

Raffy :cool:
 
R

Randy Stewart

QS/TS

TS states, under 7.4.1.2 Supplier quality management system development Note: "Unless otherwise specified by the customer, suppliers to the organization shall be third party registered to ISO 9001:2000 by an accredited third-party certification body".

QS never stated that a supplier (tier 2) had to be certified, it allowed the registered company (tier 1) to set the level of control they needed over a supplier. It was the Customer Specific Requirements that took it farther. As of now 9K2K, as a minimum, is the goal for all suppliers.

:agree:
 

Raffy

Quite Involved in Discussions
Actually, our customer is requiring us to be QS9000 certified as part of their requirement.

Thanks a lot.

Best regards,
Raffy
 
R

Randy Stewart

Why???

Raffy, it may be an exercise in frustration but I would fight them on the certification. It doesn't make much sense to pay the money for a certification to QS. Where is their "requirement" coming from? Their customer? I would push the supplier development section on them. Suggest they help you with the certification process and let them spend their time with you. You don't want to upset the customer but what they are asking is a little much. Look at the interpretations again concerning the "2nd party audits". I'm not suggesting letting them come in and do the audit, but to save you some time and money it is an option. That way you can concentrate on TS or 9K2K.
 

Manoj Mathur

Quite Involved in Discussions
My Dear Friends,

Please help me and correct me if I am wrong.
Since past three months some big customers (Tier 1) are asking from us (Tier 2) about TS2 Certification. I feel if we develope a QMS conforming to TS2 but don't invite a third party registrar for certification, I feel we should be complying the requirements of customers without investing money into it.
I strongly feel most of the clauses written in TS2 as a matter of fact even 9K or ISO 14K are good for organisation if they truely comply. I feel Nothing will go wrong if we make Control Plan as mentioned in TS 16949 or mentioned in QS 9000. We shall get many advantage if we make FMEAs and conduct MSAs . Now it should be upto us to go for certification or not. But surely we should strive to go for compliences.
 
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