Qualifying TS2 Internal Auditors & Refresher Training

[Stevenli]

TS2 internal auditor & refreshing

Dear all,

Maybe there are some similiar information in the forum, but I'd like to initiate a new thread concerning TS2 internal auditor and its refreshing.

I have two questions as following:
1. How to qualified an internal auditor which is satisfied with TS2 requirements?

2. How to refreshing/requalification the competance of internal auditor?

Maybe we can use ISO19011 chapter 7.5 as reference, but I have no idea which methods in practice are available?

Thanks a lot

 

[Marc]

I have to admit I'm not up to date on TS requirements for internal auditors. I'm sure one of the other folks can help out.

As far as refresher courses or periodic requalification, I would say that would depend upon how frequently the auditrs audit and what the person who oversees the audit outputs sees. If an auditor is performing correctly I'm not sure periodic requalification is necessary unless the standard changes.

 

[Sam]

You can enroll in the supplier auditor course offered by AIAG or you can contact your CB who will provide other reliable sources. There is no requirement for refresher training, unless it is determined that the trained auditors are not effective.
At the present time their are no requirements to become "certified" to any specific requirement. The auditor qualifications are contained in the customer specific requirements;

Ford - 4.39.1 trained and evaluated in the following:
TS2, core tools, CSR's, automotive approach to process
auditing.

GM - 4.1.10 - Qualified as recommended in ISO 19011 sections 7.1 - 7.5

Chrysler - No requirement

The distinction is somewhat different in the requirements for 2nd party (supplier audits):

Ford - Auditor or lead auditor in at least 5 internal audits to the standard being applied in the prior 3 years, or
successful completion of an accredited internal or lead auditor training in the standard being applied, and auditor or lead auditor in at least 1 audit to the standard being applied within the the prior 18 months.

GM - Similar, not as in depth

Chrysler - similar, not as in depth

 

[Randy]

Do as has been suggested by using 19011 Clause 7 to help develop auditor competence.

The word qualified that keeps getting tossed about and it being mixed with training confuses me. It seems the focus should be on developing auditor "competence" not "qualification". My reasoning falls along this line:

There are tons of schools out there that provide people training to become "qualified" aircraft mechanics (get their license). The graduates of those training courses may be "qualified" aircraft mechanics but they are nowhere near being competent. I tell you this...I feel more secure knowing that the planes I fly on are maintained by "Competent and qualified" folks than by 'qualified" ones alone.

You can develop training programs that bring folks up to speed but you cannot teach competence, it has to be acquired through using the tools that were taught in the training.

Focus your effort on developing auditor competence programs and not just training classes.