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R
Raptorwild
Randy said:
I believe you but where there is a will there is a way. I don't intend on giving up any time soon. Eventually I will get QMS Auditor or Lead Auditor status and then work on Aerospace Auditor status. I have already worked with one Registrar who is up and coming...so it is just a matter of how much work I put into getting a foot in the door.
I am pretty determined. Paula
G
Gary L. Phillips - 2007
Paula, good fortune in your upcoming new career ! !
Don't forget one of the golden rules of being a consultant: LISTEN to your client ! ! Probably more contracts and oportunities have been lost because the consultant did not fully listen to or fully understand the potential client, the needs and reasons why he/she wants the involvement of a consultant. The singular acknowledgement that they are looking for assisstance lends one to assume they are not competent to complete the task at hand. However, they may well be able to do just that, and only need assisstance from time to time when they are not quite sure how to proceed in a given area.
I, too, am keeping my day job for now. Final stages of working for a client in our small southern town conducting training and limited time on site for the T/S 16949 standard. Two others begining discussions, one in oil and gas exploration and the other in general manufacturing. I have had a tough time trying to put a price on my services, also. I finally came up with a fee schedule that is very reasonable and well under any competators within five states (I know a lot of them). Not trying to take food off their plates, still a lot of work here, but priced low enough to get my feet wet and in the door for some of our more high profile companies (name recognition helps the future) that are committed to success.
One thing for sure, is that it seems that fees are sliding down from where they were only a year or so ago. Fewer transitions and registrations, for sure, but also a lot of companies have been using (really using for improvment) their system and now want to transition to the new standard using as much of what they have learned from practice - something like the pride of doing things well. Many organizations do actually have well developed talents and have in fact been very successful at their transition experience.
The quality field has pretty much been a robust employment position over the past ten or so years, too, and a lot of people working on a well developed implementation project for an organization in the last couple of years seem to have been hired out from under their bosses and these folks (at times) do quite well working on a new progran for someone else.
It also looks like a good portion of organizations have not transitoned to the 9K:2K standard, probably due to their historically lack of true committment by senior management and their not wanting to really improve their operations. Although it seems strange, I have actually been to a site where the Man Rep and the Plant Mgr stated just that...don't want to improve (they didn't elect to transition to 9K:2K).
So there is no wonder that the fees for ISO consultants are slipping, less work to do. However, a number of people in the business are cutting back on the number of clients they will even consider if they feel there is not enough true committment from the senior management team. Most say it just ain't worth all the hair and teeth pulling and they would rather work for an organization that really is open to ideas for improving their processes, products/services, and customer relations ( read: business posture ).
Good luck in the future, maybe our paths will cross one day
Don't forget one of the golden rules of being a consultant: LISTEN to your client ! ! Probably more contracts and oportunities have been lost because the consultant did not fully listen to or fully understand the potential client, the needs and reasons why he/she wants the involvement of a consultant. The singular acknowledgement that they are looking for assisstance lends one to assume they are not competent to complete the task at hand. However, they may well be able to do just that, and only need assisstance from time to time when they are not quite sure how to proceed in a given area.
I, too, am keeping my day job for now. Final stages of working for a client in our small southern town conducting training and limited time on site for the T/S 16949 standard. Two others begining discussions, one in oil and gas exploration and the other in general manufacturing. I have had a tough time trying to put a price on my services, also. I finally came up with a fee schedule that is very reasonable and well under any competators within five states (I know a lot of them). Not trying to take food off their plates, still a lot of work here, but priced low enough to get my feet wet and in the door for some of our more high profile companies (name recognition helps the future) that are committed to success.
One thing for sure, is that it seems that fees are sliding down from where they were only a year or so ago. Fewer transitions and registrations, for sure, but also a lot of companies have been using (really using for improvment) their system and now want to transition to the new standard using as much of what they have learned from practice - something like the pride of doing things well. Many organizations do actually have well developed talents and have in fact been very successful at their transition experience.
The quality field has pretty much been a robust employment position over the past ten or so years, too, and a lot of people working on a well developed implementation project for an organization in the last couple of years seem to have been hired out from under their bosses and these folks (at times) do quite well working on a new progran for someone else.
It also looks like a good portion of organizations have not transitoned to the 9K:2K standard, probably due to their historically lack of true committment by senior management and their not wanting to really improve their operations. Although it seems strange, I have actually been to a site where the Man Rep and the Plant Mgr stated just that...don't want to improve (they didn't elect to transition to 9K:2K).
So there is no wonder that the fees for ISO consultants are slipping, less work to do. However, a number of people in the business are cutting back on the number of clients they will even consider if they feel there is not enough true committment from the senior management team. Most say it just ain't worth all the hair and teeth pulling and they would rather work for an organization that really is open to ideas for improving their processes, products/services, and customer relations ( read: business posture ).
Good luck in the future, maybe our paths will cross one day
R
Raptorwild
Cost of a Consultant
Thanks Gary,
Well I met with the General Manager and the Account Exec. last Friday. It went very well! The GM said he felt I am perfect for their company. He had to go for a meeting with their mother company next week to report on what he found so I would not hear anything for sure untill a week or so. The Acct. Exec. walked out with me and said I was everything he told his boss I would be and felt it was an excellent meeting. So now I will just wait and wait and wait ever so happily Oh I forgot, I don't have time to wait around, I have to get ready for our AS9100A Audit in a couple of weeks! The more I try to get ready the more things I find wrong. Thanks again Gary. 
Thanks Gary,
Well I met with the General Manager and the Account Exec. last Friday. It went very well! The GM said he felt I am perfect for their company. He had to go for a meeting with their mother company next week to report on what he found so I would not hear anything for sure untill a week or so. The Acct. Exec. walked out with me and said I was everything he told his boss I would be and felt it was an excellent meeting. So now I will just wait and wait and wait ever so happily
Oh I forgot, I don't have time to wait around, I have to get ready for our AS9100A Audit in a couple of weeks! The more I try to get ready the more things I find wrong. Thanks again Gary. 
I've had some like this, but in the last couple of years ISO consultants have multiplied everywhere. In the late 1990's I was charging US$4000 a week plus travel and expenses, and US$1250 per day for 'quickie' visits. Up until 2001 I charged most companies a non-refundable retainer of between US$10K and US$20K for a project based upon the idea that if they backed out the time I scheduled for them would be 'lost'.Randy said:Marc is pretty much right on.....mostly anyhow
Many times I let my clients set the price. I've got one that set it at $900 onsite per day, $300 per day travel + costs, and $125 per hr offsite. They had to twist my arm to get me to take it
But as more and more folks entered the 'race', and all the large companies which were doing the QS 'dance' had done it, it came down to serious competition and those prices would have me out of the competition early.
Now days sometimes I do stuff for as low as US$30 an hour. It depends a lot upon what someone wants done and my schedule. Clear schedule, price goes down..
Those days are long gone.....
L
Laura M
Raptorwild said:
Does your company require any "conflict of interest" documentation. Can you take the job if you got it because of your role there? Just asking....
I guess I'm cheap based on the above - or its a supply/demand. I've been 'around' $75/hour. I do not do much traveling - and didn't want to deal with charging for mileage. So depending on how far away they are by car, I adjust the above, and mileage is expensed. On the other hand, I've done no marketing. Most small shop clients are word of mouth. Regarding Marc's quote - one of the things I do is a "free" gap analysis...to help me develop the quote. If the quote is accepted - its free. If they decline the quote...meaning they can pass along my assessment to someone else for a quote - or so they can take it on their own (I list areas of major and minor concerns)...could even turn into an Internal Audit if they call it as such... then they pay my day rate, I've only been taken up on that offer once, and to be honest, when I sent the bill, I didn't expect it to get paid, but they did. Every other quote I approached in that manner, I've been awarded. Rates will go up next year - it only makes sense after remaining steady for 2 years.
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R
Raptorwild
Hello Laura,Laura M said:
I asked my boss if he would mind and he said to go for it, especially since business is slow. We have been on 32 hour work weeks for about 6 months. He understands that I need to find other ways to supplement my income.
I dont see it as a conflict of interest, they are a supplier of a product we purchased once.
Now I will act as a supplier to provide them with this service that will help them (I HOPE) to become a better supplier to everyone. That is if they accept my quote.
Thanks,
Paula
E
encee98
Greetings.
This is just to say that I'm glad, really glad to have found the Cove. I am a provisional qms auditor and I always turn to the Cove whenever I have qms related concerns. Just recently, a manufacturing company asked me for quotation to help them set up a quality management system that will undergo certification. Although I do provide consulting services to small companies who had to align their qms (not necessarily be certified) to ISO 9002:1994 and lately, ISO 9001:2000 to meet regulatory requirements, these efforts are more of spoonfeeding, as one of my clients gratefully admitted. For this new project, I am thinking of being more of a guide and director rather than part-time driver. I have no idea how much a "real" consulting service cost and the consultant's scope of work. With the rough estimates given previously, I can make the currency conversion (PhP50 ~ 1$) and hopefully come up with a price which the company would consider enough of an investment for them to take the effort seriously. My previous fees are way lower, considering the size and capability of the firms.
Here's hoping that someday, I could make meaningful contributions to the Cove.
Naomi
This is just to say that I'm glad, really glad to have found the Cove. I am a provisional qms auditor and I always turn to the Cove whenever I have qms related concerns. Just recently, a manufacturing company asked me for quotation to help them set up a quality management system that will undergo certification. Although I do provide consulting services to small companies who had to align their qms (not necessarily be certified) to ISO 9002:1994 and lately, ISO 9001:2000 to meet regulatory requirements, these efforts are more of spoonfeeding, as one of my clients gratefully admitted. For this new project, I am thinking of being more of a guide and director rather than part-time driver. I have no idea how much a "real" consulting service cost and the consultant's scope of work. With the rough estimates given previously, I can make the currency conversion (PhP50 ~ 1$) and hopefully come up with a price which the company would consider enough of an investment for them to take the effort seriously. My previous fees are way lower, considering the size and capability of the firms.
Here's hoping that someday, I could make meaningful contributions to the Cove.
Naomi
