Rank of Findings

D

Dor Marchan

#11
Thank you for your reply...
Yes, I also heard that Document and Data Control (4.5), Process Control (4.9) and Control of Inspection, Measuring and Test (4.11) are the top three. However, I just want to have a more concrete evidence.

Is there anyone there who made a survey regarding this topic???

Regards,
Dor Marchan
 
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barb butrym

Quite Involved in Discussions
#12
yes Marc...there is a matrix of man days ....I have one somewhere from RVA/UCAS..let me go and find it (no small task...LOL)

On the rank issue, there are as many takes on that as there are auditors......each system has its own built in weakness...the larger more global elements will always have a tendency to have more as there are more cooks in the kitchen and more opportunities to have an 'opps' happen...so in that I agree the elements you called out are more likely to have findings...but if you have a grip on that and know it needs more attention to detail, then you naturally decrease the opportunity for findings in that element...companies and consultants have strong points as well...that skew the stats. All in all its a question without an answer.
 
W

waberens

#13
Appendix H of the "Quality System Reguirements" QS-9000 Third Edition has the table for on-site auditor days. Also includes how to adjust for special situations.
Recently received a reprint from "The Registrar" a publication of Quality Systems Registrars,Inc. Top 10 areas of noncompliance are: 4.5 Document and Data 292; 4.6 Purchasing 196; 4.11 IMTE 187; 4.10 Inspection and Testing 87; 4.14 Corrective and Preventive Action 82; 4.9 Process Control 71; 4.16 Control of Quality Records 67; 4.13 Control of Nonconforming Product 64; 4.1 Management Responsibility 58; 4.17 Internal Quality Audits 55. It also adds that for ISO 9001 design control is a major pitfall.
Bill
 

Marc

Hunkered Down for the Duration with a Mask on...
Staff member
Admin
#14
Yeah - I know QS does - ISO technically doesn't but Barb says registrar accreditation folks do.
 
W

waberens

#15
If you go to the RAB site you can find their table of assessment times. It lines up with QS-9000 tables for the most part.
www.rabnet.com/content/qr_crit1.htm

Look in Annex 1 Assessment Times

Sorry, I do not know how to make this a hotlink. Oh, I guess it links automatically if the right options are turned on.


Bill

[This message has been edited by waberens (edited 17 September 1999).]
 

Marc

Hunkered Down for the Duration with a Mask on...
Staff member
Admin
#16
Thanks for the link! That pretty well says it all about audit days!
 
D

David Guffey

#17
Dor, may I repectfully suggest you not get hung up by worrying about "rank"? Even if I had ten findings in Document and Data Control, what you and your company does has no relativity to mine. So, it's not important.

Of the 19 elements (or 18 if Service is descoped), just do your best to ensure your company is ready. Then if there are findings, address them with sincerity and vigor. Over time, you and your company will improve and a good, value-adding auditor will continue to peel away the onion. Don't loose sleep over it.

[This message has been edited by David Guffey (edited 21 October 1999).]
 
D

Dor Marchan

#18
Hi David,
Thank you for your advise.
Actually, our ISO audit is finished last 22-23 Sep 99 and guess what..... ZERO noncompliance!
Our consultant (NOVO Quality Services) was speechless. They only said that in their consulting and auditing experience, 3M-Singapore is the first company that they consulted to have 0 noncompliance. And when they asked who was the auditor, they were more surprised becuase the lead auditor is the current representative of PSB to ISO. (And she is really stringent.)
But, of course, we are prepared and ready. Most of our system in computerized and everyone is committed.
Now, we are including other areas and product lines for the surveillance audit on March 2000. Plus, we are going for ISO 14000 and OSHAS18000 on July 2000.
Other than that, I'm also going to propose to our management to have our technical center to be ISO Guide 25 (or to be ISO 17025) certified. I guess they would...
That's all I can say...again, thank you.
Regards,
Dor Marchan
 
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