Registrar Charges Per CAR Written

[Cari Spears]

So I'm looking at a quote for registration services, and it says:

"Auditor CAR Review will be billed at $90 per CAR written."

Does anyone else's registrar charge per CAR?

 

[Sidney Vianna]

Never seen that. I have seen CB's that charge a fee to review appeals, but, up until now, a charge to review corrective action plans, per CAR, is news to me. Looks like some of the CB's, in their downward spiral, race to the bottom, like to follow the nickleing and dimeing, everything a la carte, business models.

It is just a matter of time until one boasts (EXPLICITLY) to be the low-cost, no frills registrar. It is amazing the lack of business acumen some registrar representatives demonstrate. The charge per corrective action plan review will just create more potential friction and animosity between audit teams and auditees, because, now, there is a clear and direct financial impact to registrants, based on the number of nonconformities. It is a built-in potential perception of conflict of interest.

20 years ago was a common thing for CB auditors to remind clients: "we don't get paid by the number of NC's". Now, they do.

 

[Ninja]

Is this for registration?
Or for using them specifically as an outsourced CA reviewer?

For an outsourced CA reviewer, it makes perfect sense...items sell at $X each...

 

[Michael_M]

If this is the Registrar then I see a 'hidden' agenda to find the most CA's one can even if a corrective action does not exist. Granted, at $90 per CA, generally speaking they are not adding much to the final cost of registration but it does add up and brings about (as others have said), a conflict of interest.

 

[Cari Spears]

It is the proposal for registration services from a well-known registrar. They also charge an annual registration maintenance of $650 per year.

I was working with this registrar at the company I used to be with from 2000-2008, and I didn't see this stuff. Then I was with a different registrar from 2008-2013, and didn't pay this stuff.

I work in the aerospace group of a very large company now, so I take care of customer audits and such, but the AS9100 registration was not my responsibility, so I had not seen their quote until recently.

I'm bummed about this registrar for a number of reasons these last few years. When I first started working here, I thought it would be great to be working with them again, because I had such a great experience with them at the last place.

Charging per CAR is ridiculous - for all the reasons you guys stated.

 

[Golfman25]

Our current charges per CAR. Worked pretty well for a while when we had only a few CAR here and there. But then we got hit by a real "winner" who nit picked us to death. It was all BS. We fought as best we could, but the "fix" was in. If the Registrar is who I am thinking, run, don't walk, away. Like you, we had good experience in the past. Now, not so much. We won't be using them any longer.

 

[Sidney Vianna]

Charging per CAR is ridiculous - for all the reasons you guys stated.

I can see that it could make for EVEN more heated discussions about the validity of the reported nonconformities. When a (contract) auditor benefits financially from writing up multiple nonconformities, instead of potentially aggregating multiple instances of similar problems into one, the relationship between the registrant and registrar just gets more adversarial.

 

[AndyN]

I understand that, in one case, a CB makes it a financial disadvantage for their auditors to write NCs. Any reports etc which are created, beyond the "normal", attract a cost of processing penalty...

You can also add that some costs are paid "up front" for the whole 3 years, non-refundable deposits are charged (based on the total fees for the 3 year period) which dissuade clients if they get bad service. One CB, I believe, charges for early termination of the agreement too...

 

[Marc]

Nothing surprises me. That's why, back around 20 years ago, I made some Excel spreadsheets for my clients to compare registrars. Some charged for auditor travel time, so if the auditor drove... A company could end up with one heck of a bill for auditor travel alone.

Head back in time... Attachment Listing Search for registrar

Look for Registrar_Comparison_1.xls and Registrar_Comparison_2.xls - Should also be in Old pdf_files directory

 

[Randy]

I can see that it could make for EVEN more heated discussions about the validity of the reported nonconformities. When a (contract) auditor benefits financially from writing up multiple nonconformities, instead of potentially aggregating multiple instances of similar problems into one, the relationship between the registrant and registrar just gets more adversarial.

One thing for sure, I don't get krap for reviewing CAR's for NC's I write...Not one red cent!