Rendering Scrap Unusable before Disposal (AS9100D, Section 8.7)

WCHorn

Rubber, Too Glamorous?
Trusted Information Resource
#1
Reference: AS9100D, Section 8.7

The referenced section stipulates that "Product dispositioned for scrap shall be conspicuously and permanently marked, or positively controlled, until physically rendered unusable." I see that a similar statement occurs in ITAF 16949, Section 8.7.1.7 (which was not in ISO/TS 16949:2009).

We make product for aerospace, automotive and a host of other commodities. We render product unusable, regardless of commodity, and it's a bit burdensome.

Is it permissible for an organization to render unusable only the aerospace and automotive product, and just scrap other product, as long as the aerospace and automotive product is controlled prior to rendering it unusable?
 
Elsmar Forum Sponsor

Sidney Vianna

Post Responsibly
Staff member
Admin
#2
Is it permissible for an organization to render unusable only the aerospace and automotive product, and just scrap other product, as long as the aerospace and automotive product is controlled prior to rendering it unusable?
Yes, in my estimation. Augmented requirements (above and beyond 9001:2015) are expected to be complied with, within the scope of the system, as you lined up, provided the scope of certification does not misrepresent that the AS9100 certification also includes "commercial" products. If your AS9100 certificate scope includes commercial products, in addition to the aerospace ones, then AS9100 should apply also to the commercial products.

The other day I saw an AS9100:2016 certificate that included aerospace, commercial and medical products. That's the recipe for a disaster in my experience. On the other hand, many auditors don't pay attention to the scope of certification and it's implication onto the scope of an audit.
 

normzone

Trusted Information Resource
#3
Wow, that's a wild one, [Sidney].

Related war story, outfit I worked with way back in the previous century that made early generation digital cameras had some circuit boards that periodically failed test. I acquired some via nonconforming material process, marked them with the NMR number, and when it was time to scrap them put them in the dumpster while employees were on break.

The employees knew these boards could be difficult to get, so they fished them out of the dumpster, saved them until there was a component shortage and put them into products in build.

They failed test, of course, and came back to me on NMR again. I looked at them, saw the old NMR numbers and went WTF? When I learned the tale, next time I scrapped them I did it while the employees were out there on break where they could witness this, but hit them with a hammer first.

So you may want to consider rendering ALL components unfit for use. Some of that stuff may feed the counterfeit food chain as well. I have a peer who saw an aerospace aircraft part he was familiar with being used as a truck bumper in his town. :)
 

howste

Thaumaturge
Super Moderator
#4
Yes, in my estimation. Augmented requirements (above and beyond 9001:2015) are expected to be complied with, within the scope of the system, as you lined up, provided the scope of certification does not misrepresent that the AS9100 certification also includes "commercial" products. If your AS9100 certificate scope includes commercial products, in addition to the aerospace ones, then AS9100 should apply also to the commercial products.
I agree that the certification scope is key to what needs to be rendered unusable. Let's look at some actual AS9100 scopes taken from the OASIS database. Do you agree with my interpretations here?

The Manufacture and Distribution of Custom Molded Rubber Products, Seals, Gaskets and Packings for Aerospace and Commercial Industries
Clearly with this scope, they would have to render scrap unusable from all of the commercial products in addition to the aerospace ones.

Manufacture, testing and inspection of precision molded elastometric products for the aerospace, oil exploration, medical, and commercial industries.
It looks like pretty much all of their scrap would need to be rendered unusable unless they also provide product for the pet chew toy industry. :mg:

The manufacture of machined plastics for the Aerospace Industry; and the distribution and sales of industrial plastics and laminates
For this one, only manufactured aerospace parts and commercial purchased parts for distribution would need to be rendered unusable.

The Manufacture and Distribution of Rubber O-Rings and Custom-Shaped Seals, including Rubber-to-Metal Bonded Seals
This one doesn't specify aerospace or commercial. My interpretation is that since the industry is not specified that all scrap rubber products would need to be rendered unusable regardless of what industry it is for.
 

Michael_M

Trusted Information Resource
#6
For our scrap, we just keep all 'scrap' in a locked bin by material type (machine shop). Our recycler has given us a letter of verification that any material (including parts) are melted down.
 

howste

Thaumaturge
Super Moderator
#7
For our scrap, we just keep all 'scrap' in a locked bin by material type (machine shop). Our recycler has given us a letter of verification that any material (including parts) are melted down.
Devil's advocate asks: Do you have positive control until they melt it down? How does your company know that the other company didn't take some parts out before they melted the rest?
 
Thread starter Similar threads Forum Replies Date
S AS9100 Clause 8.3 "Rendering Scrap Unusable" AS9100, IAQG, NADCAP and Aerospace related Standards and Requirements 28
A Rendering Product unusable... if it's owned by the Customer? AS9100, IAQG, NADCAP and Aerospace related Standards and Requirements 11
M Targets / limits for PPM/ Scrap Manufacturing and Related Processes 2
M Scrap metric/ Waste metric Manufacturing and Related Processes 1
S Cost of Poor Quality (CoPQ) - Scrap element of calculation includes lost margin? Misc. Quality Assurance and Business Systems Related Topics 7
Q IATF rule for single site - Ingots from scrap metal recycling company IATF 16949 - Automotive Quality Systems Standard 0
F Determining what type of scrap to include in my internal PPM calculation Quality Manager and Management Related Issues 5
N Interesting Discussion Murder mystery and mission creep - Challenged to eliminate scrap AS9100, IAQG, NADCAP and Aerospace related Standards and Requirements 27
Sidney Vianna IAQG News Future AS9147- Management of Unsalvageable Parts - Previous scrap parts AS9100, IAQG, NADCAP and Aerospace related Standards and Requirements 1
A Scrap is NCR or not - What regulation ISO 9000, ISO 9001, and ISO 9004 Quality Management Systems Standards 33
N Establishing a monthly scrap cost target Lean in Manufacturing and Service Industries 11
J IATF 16949 Clause 8.7.1.7 Nonconforming Product Disposition - Scrap Rendered Unusable IATF 16949 - Automotive Quality Systems Standard 64
S Scrap % Calculation Formula Manufacturing and Related Processes 10
R DPPM? Scrap? Both? How to report Returns Misc. Quality Assurance and Business Systems Related Topics 6
N Ways to Destroy Scrap Parts AS9100, IAQG, NADCAP and Aerospace related Standards and Requirements 10
N What Can I Do With Plastic Pellet Scrap? Manufacturing and Related Processes 17
Z Scrap Process - They weren't Physically (Dimensionally) Nonconforming Manufacturing and Related Processes 6
S Cell Rubber Stamping PPM for Scrap Analysis Quality Tools, Improvement and Analysis 1
C Severity of Effect on Process (Manufacturing/Assembly Effect) Scrap or Reworking FMEA and Control Plans 3
J Looking for reference to Electronics Industry's Standard Scrap Rates ISO 9000, ISO 9001, and ISO 9004 Quality Management Systems Standards 5
R How to Handle 'Scrap and Replace' of Non-Conforming Products Nonconformance and Corrective Action 9
M Start Up Scrap vs. ppm (Parts per Million) in an FMEA IATF 16949 - Automotive Quality Systems Standard 17
Q Temporary Control of Scrap at the Machines while the Process is Running Nonconformance and Corrective Action 6
J Scrap, Control or Marking - Ball Bearing Distribution and Re-Lubrication AS9100, IAQG, NADCAP and Aerospace related Standards and Requirements 3
Q ISO 9001 Clause 8.3: Scrap, Rework, Repair, Why? ISO 9000, ISO 9001, and ISO 9004 Quality Management Systems Standards 5
A Disposition of Reject vs. Scrap Material Nonconformance and Corrective Action 6
F Do we need to destroy all nonconforming scrap product - AS9100C AS9100, IAQG, NADCAP and Aerospace related Standards and Requirements 24
D Scrap Procedures - Example wanted Quality Manager and Management Related Issues 2
N Scrap Stored Long Term in MRB - ISO 9001 Nonconformance or Annoyance? ISO 9000, ISO 9001, and ISO 9004 Quality Management Systems Standards 8
A Calculating Scrap Level for Cp=0.97 Statistical Analysis Tools, Techniques and SPC 3
R Analysing Scrap from Machinery Statistical Analysis Tools, Techniques and SPC 8
P Disposal of Plastic used in Medical Parts (Scrap) ISO 13485:2016 - Medical Device Quality Management Systems 4
Q Scrap + Replacement always? ISO 9000, ISO 9001, and ISO 9004 Quality Management Systems Standards 8
B Gather and Analyze Production Scrap - MiniTab 16 vs. Excel Data Analysis Quality Assurance and Compliance Software Tools and Solutions 5
P Scrap handling system in soap industry - example Lean in Manufacturing and Service Industries 1
N Quality Objective - Scrap Measureables ISO 9000, ISO 9001, and ISO 9004 Quality Management Systems Standards 13
C Discarding Customer Scrap product without their knowledge Misc. Quality Assurance and Business Systems Related Topics 4
A Scrap vs. Rework Classification - Scraping the resistor or reworking the PCB board? Quality Tools, Improvement and Analysis 10
L Quality Objectives Ideas - Currently we have Scrap & rework, OTD, survey results, etc Manufacturing and Related Processes 50
E Recording Scrap - Problems in the Medical Device Manufacturing Sector ISO 13485:2016 - Medical Device Quality Management Systems 4
A How do I set up a PPM with Total pcs shipped vs. Total Scrap for the month Statistical Analysis Tools, Techniques and SPC 10
A Control Chart to Track Effectiveness of Actions to Reduce Scrap Rate Six Sigma 7
P Study of Scrap on one of our production lines - What to use? Gage R&R (GR&R) and MSA (Measurement Systems Analysis) 11
L Control of Nonconforming Product in a Tool Shop - Scrap Dies Nonconformance and Corrective Action 5
B Unregistered Bulk Scrap Metal Suppliers - Do they need to be ISO 9001 certified? IATF 16949 - Automotive Quality Systems Standard 10
T Nonconformity Records - Nonconformity vs. Scrap - 8.3 Requirements Records and Data - Quality, Legal and Other Evidence 14
O Scrap rate in the iron foundry casting industry Benchmarking 3
SteelMaiden Scrap Trader Kidnapped? UK scrap trader kidnapped by Chinese client World News 5
B The correct approach to calculating Internal Scrap ppm Statistical Analysis Tools, Techniques and SPC 3
kmyers Scrap Material Areas - How to control nonconforming material ISO 9000, ISO 9001, and ISO 9004 Quality Management Systems Standards 11

Similar threads

Top Bottom