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Rules for Achieving IATF Recognition: 4th edition for ISO/TS 16949

H

Helmut Jilling

Auditor / Consultant
#91
#91
Review the details with your CB. There are some exceptions to this unfortunate rule, and your CB should know what the latest interpretations are that would apply to you. One notable exception appears to be if it does not have a unique address.
 
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C

ChrissieO

#92
#92
soulmas said:
xfngrs... I just noticed that nobody replied you back.... OK, the answer is that it will be considered as a manufacturing location... so, you will have to consider that location like a stand alone manufacturing plant.. even that it is just crossing the street, being in a different address, it will be considered as independent from your main mfg location.

With the new rules... my auditor days increased a lot....

however you can reduce the number of auditor days having a mini-corporate scheme.. with your new mfg location and your main location, you can apply the 20% discount.
Click to expand...
I am a little confused here, how can Receiving, Shipping and Tollgate be classed as manufacturing.

We are a Warehouse and Distribution Centre for the UK and are currently recognised as a remote location for one of our manufacturing plants in Germany. Does this mean we will also need our own certification?
 
xfngrs

xfngrs

Quite Involved in Discussions
#93
#93
I was wondering about that too. Our auditor seemed to think if it is just logistics it can be a warehuse, but if we did washing their as well it would probably be manufacturing. He was going to ask someone at IAOB, but we haven't received an answer since July so I don't know where we stand.
 
H

Helmut Jilling

Auditor / Consultant
#94
#94
xfngrs said:
I was wondering about that too. Our auditor seemed to think if it is just logistics it can be a warehuse, but if we did washing their as well it would probably be manufacturing. He was going to ask someone at IAOB, but we haven't received an answer since July so I don't know where we stand.
Click to expand...
A couple years ago, when they still had "site extensions," that was the interpretation. It cost me a minor in an IATF witness audit. The client had a separate, freestanding warehouse with 5 personnel. I classified it as a Shipping warehouse. The witness auditor disagreed and said the washing operation made it "manufacturing." I would expect the same interpretation would still apply.
 
D

delorfra

Involved In Discussions
#95
#95
Concerning these new rules, is there any requirement defining the notion of reoccurrence for non-conformities ?

During our last certification audit, we had a non-conformity concerning Go/No-go gages R&R (MSA) that was not carried out at all. Then, during our internal audit carried out by consultants 6 months later, the auditors identified that the method used for R&R calculation was not fully comprehensive. They considered that it was a reoccurence and then qualified it as a major non-conformity even though it was not exactly the same deviation.

What's your opinion on this ?

Thanks in advance
 
L

LUV-d-4UM

Quite Involved in Discussions
#96
#96
Hi there,
"Then, during our internal audit carried out by consultants 6 months later, the auditors identified that the method used for R&R calculation was not fully comprehensive."

What is the customer requirement regarding MSA? Need to get this clarified first. Auditors have learning curves too.
 
K

krishkaar

Involved In Discussions
#97
#97
Can some expert please comment on this:

Is this statement from IATF OR is it from the CB?

Additional audit time (Ref: IATF Rules 4th Edition sec 5.7.2a) BEFORE the opening meeting of each audit the auditor has to verify ON-SITE the changes within the Company, actual customer and internal performance data, customer online portals and scorecards, as well as customer reviews. Based on the analysis, the areas of focus during the audit will be prioritized. This additional time will not be a part of calculated audit time. Additional charges are applicable for added man hours, which will be mutually discussed and agreed.
 
E

Englishman Abroad

Involved In Discussions
#98
#98
Krishkaar,

This is from the 4th edition of the IATF rules (section 5.7.2 a as you have quoted). - It is not quite the word for word copy, but the intent is the same.

The rules request a minimum of 1 hour on site to review customer and internal performance data, including a review of online customer portals. The audit plan shall be adjusted if needed after review of this data.
The time ( min 1 hr) is not considered by the IATF as audit time, however I would consider that someone (you) will have to pay the auditor for their time.
(The cost of the audit time is not discussed in the rules. )
 
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