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Sequence and Interaction of the Processes - Please review my Process Map

A

ambrosedierdre

#1
Can someone please have a look at my process map. I'm just wanting to know if its right to satisfy the 4.1 requirement. I'm also wanting advice if the 'product realisation' section is right... I'm not really sure what our business core processes are that I should be putting on this. We are a consulting engineering firm, civil, structural, hydraulic.

Thanks in advance
 

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qusys

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#2
Can someone please have a look at my process map. I'm just wanting to know if its right to satisfy the 4.1 requirement. I'm also wanting advice if the 'product realisation' section is right... I'm not really sure what our business core processes are that I should be putting on this. We are a consulting engineering firm, civil, structural, hydraulic.

Thanks in advance
I do not know if customer related processes are clear enough...
Besides, don't you have any procurement processes?:bigwave:
 
K

kgott

#3
Can someone please have a look at my process map. I'm just wanting to know if its right to satisfy the 4.1 requirement. I'm also wanting advice if the 'product realisation' section is right... I'm not really sure what our business core processes are that I should be putting on this. We are a consulting engineering firm, civil, structural, hydraulic.

Thanks in advance
One of the best experts on this matter on this forum is Patricia Ravanello. She goes to great lengths to stress that this diagam is only about key management system processes and not about the product realisation processes.

Check the litte green rectangle at the very top of this page and search for her name and or posts. Patricia has not posted on this forum for some time but you will find all her postings on this issue in the green box above.

There many other very good people on this forum aslo so note their perspectives as well.
 

howste

Thaumaturge
Super Moderator
#4
Hi Ambrosedierdre, welcome to The Cove! :bigwave:

Can someone please have a look at my process map. I'm just wanting to know if its right to satisfy the 4.1 requirement. I'm also wanting advice if the 'product realisation' section is right... I'm not really sure what our business core processes are that I should be putting on this. We are a consulting engineering firm, civil, structural, hydraulic.

Thanks in advance
Look at your diagram and try to follow some specific information or a customer order through the system. Can you? If not, the sequence is probably inadequate. Where does the diagram describe the interactions between the processes? If you can't find them, it's probably inadequate.

My first recommendation is to throw away the diagram that you pulled out of ISO 9001 and start over. There is no requirement to fit all of your processes into four blocks that inconveniently have the same name as major clauses of the standard.

When you said,
I'm not really sure what our business core processes are that I should be putting on this.
I read that you're trying to force your business into the diagram rather than incorporate controls that meet ISO 9001 requirements into your business.

You need to first "determine the processes needed for the quality management system" within your business. Most of them already exist, or the company probably wouldn't still be in business. Many of them are probably already in your diagram, but they may not be organized in the sequence you do them in your business. When you're done, it should look like the way you do things, and probably somewhat different from another company's.

Between the processes there should be something that describes, at least at a high level, what the interaction(s) are. In my opinion more detailed descriptions of the interactions could be elsewhere in the system. Here's a link to a diagram I posted in another thread as an example - yours will probably look different: Sample process map2.ppt
 
S

ssz102

#5
generally speaking, this diagram are good, but, i think that product realization section need to be more fully
 
A

ambrosedierdre

#6
Thanks everyone for your inputs. I have searched that lady's name and been reading all morning, it has left me more confused than ever but I'm still reading so hopefully the light will turn on soon.
 

harry

Super Moderator
#7
Thanks everyone for your inputs. I have searched that lady's name and been reading all morning, it has left me more confused than ever but I'm still reading so hopefully the light will turn on soon.
I am guessing that your background is not manufacturing, that's the reason why you are confused. If the process map you attached is yours for a start, I am not too worried. Chances are, you will see things in much clearer perspective as you move along and you can always come back to revise this map (nothing wrong if you don't get it right at first try).

Right now, I think the biggest problem you faced is not knowing the core processes of your business. Interview and find out from the key personnel.
 
A

ambrosedierdre

#8
Well, we do up quotes to suit the clients needs, they review/sign it, it comes back and we start the job. Drafters then get the work checked, then it goes out to the client. We then do inspections (for example, site inspections on the footings and slabs) issue a certifcate, invoicing.

So once the core processes are correct, would the whole diagram suit the requirement? One thing i found this morning from Patricia's posts was that the standard isn't asking to identify the processes for Product Realisation, but rather the processess for the management system... :bonk: :frust:
 
A

ambrosedierdre

#9
I am guessing that your background is not manufacturing, that's the reason why you are confused.
Nope, administrator turned into Quality Co-ordinator. Lots of learning to do and courses to attend.
 
S

snappy

#10
Well, we do up quotes to suit the clients needs, they review/sign it, it comes back and we start the job. Drafters then get the work checked, then it goes out to the client. We then do inspections (for example, site inspections on the footings and slabs) issue a certifcate, invoicing.

So once the core processes are correct, would the whole diagram suit the requirement? One thing i found this morning from Patricia's posts was that the standard isn't asking to identify the processes for Product Realization, but rather the processes for the management system... :bonk: :frust:
You need to determine product realization processes that are included in your quality management system. But don't make the common mistake of identifying the product realization REQUIREMENTS as being your organization's realization PROCESSES.

Also, I wonder if "product verification" and "design" are two different processes. Design processes normally extend through design verification and product validation. I understand that you design something, then verify that your designs satisfy the input criteria. And somebody else builds it. And then you see if what was built satisfies the design input requirements. (This is validation.)

In an engineering consulting firm, it is very possible that you have only three realization processes: Sales, Purchasing, and Design. (I'm guessing you must purchase computer hardware or software or maybe training or something that impacts the quality of your provided services, so a procurement function probably exists and should be documented as a process.) Another thought. Engineering firms often operate in project fashion. Do you engage in project management? If a project management process is in place, this process should be recognized as a realization process and documented accordingly (in addition to, or perhaps preferably to include the design process).
 
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