Setting up a New QMS for Certification when ISO 9001 is about to Change

[Frankie11]

I thought it might be an interesting discussion. If you've got a company looking to be certified to ISO 9001 in the next 6-12 months, as the quality manager what do you do? If you work for a CB, what would you be recommending? Anyone else in this position now or previously?

I've been asked to get a company certification-ready ASAP so that's where I'm coming from. It seems like a bit of a waste of time to get them up to compliance with the 2008 version when it's all going to change in a year.

Cheers!

 

[Big Jim]

Re: Setting up a new QMS for certification when the standard is about to change

The third option is not a viable answer, as the new standard is still in draft so you don't want to make changes based on what might be.

As a consultant I certainly would not attempt to set up a new system to 9001:2015 until the ink dries on the final version.

Beyond that, it depends on how badly they want to get registered, including how much they have a customer breathing down their neck to get it done.

Keep in mind that, last I knew, the intention is for a three year transition from the current standard to the new one, with the anticipation that most companies will transition when their old one comes due for re-certification. A company that gets registered this year (2014) would likely face transition in 2017.

 

[Claes Gefvenberg]

Re: Setting up a new QMS for certification when the standard is about to change

I agree with Big Jim, and...

Beyond that, it depends on how badly they want to get registered, including how much they have a customer breathing down their neck to get it done.

...this is what it really boils down to, and as you have been asked to get a company certification-ready ASAP, the answer seems pretty obvious. Mind you, setting up a system is always worthwhile as long as it is properly adapted to the wants and needs of your business.

 

[John Broomfield]

Re: Setting up a new QMS for certification when the standard is about to change

I voted for Other.

The management system standard does not change what your organizational management system needs for your organization to be successful.

Too many sets of management system documents are written to conform to the standard and imposed on the organization. They are written for little more than obtaining certification as soon as. And managers and other employees correctly see this as a waste.

By understanding how your organization works as a system to fulfill its mission or purpose, you focus on your organization's processes, interactions and behaviors not on the standard.

For many people this is counter-intuitive until they really think about what they are trying to do. They may sense that they lack sufficient authority (delegated from the top manager) to do anything more than slavishly follow the standard.

You analyze your system and its processes instead of writing documents based on the standard. You focus resources needed for any new processes only after your analysis shows the process does not exist.

"What about a new process or control specified by the new standard", I hear you ask. Rarely is the process entirely new and always know and agree the business benefits of the new process before engaging its process team members in designing it to fulfill those benefits.

 

[Colin]

Re: Setting up a New QMS for Certification when the Standard is about to Change

Apart from the possibility that other requirements will be added to the current CD (unlikely I suspect), I don't see a problem in creating the system against what we have now.

What is there in the 2008 version that is not in the CD? not much if anything at all. So if you met the CD you would meet the 2008 version anyway - it would just look a bit different and as we know, you can make it look like you want to as long as it addresses the clauses.

I have just finished putting together a manual for a combined 9001 and 27001 and because 27001 is in the new format, I structured the manual against it. Mind you, I have not applied to the CB yet!

 

[qpled]

Re: Setting up a New QMS for Certification when the Standard is about to Change

It seems like a bit of a waste of time to get them up to compliance with the 2008 version when it's all going to change in a year.

Cheers!

I am in a similar situation since we are being re-certified in fall 2014 - not good timing but just the way it worked out. So my advice to you (and myself) is to comply to 2008 while keeping an eye on the 2015 draft to see what will/may change - and warn the company you are working for that they will need you again very soon

 

[SuperGirl]

Re: Setting up a new QMS for certification when the standard is about to change

I chose other, and agree with this:

The management system standard does not change what your organizational management system needs for your organization to be successful.

Too many sets of management system documents are written to conform to the standard and imposed on the organization. They are written for little more than obtaining certification as soon as. And managers and other employees correctly see this as a waste.

If you don't set up your system for what your business needs, but simply to obtain certification, you will not have complete buy in from everyone and while you may obtain certification, you will, if not fail, have a very difficult time obtaining re-certification.

 

[AndyN]

Re: Setting up a New QMS for Certification when the Standard is about to Change

I thought it might be an interesting discussion. If you've got a company looking to be certified to ISO 9001 in the next 6-12 months, as the quality manager what do you do? If you work for a CB, what would you be recommending? Anyone else in this position now or previously?

I've been asked to get a company certification-ready ASAP so that's where I'm coming from. It seems like a bit of a waste of time to get them up to compliance with the 2008 version when it's all going to change in a year.

Cheers!

Look at it this way: If implementing a QMS and obtaining certification is a strategic decision, then go for it. In all reality, the standard may change, but not in a substantial manner that you will need to do so much changing and, even if you did, you still have 3 years to make those after 2015. You should be focused on the benefits of what a QMS can bring now, not on wondering how much work might be needed to change (unknown) later.

Be like Nike, just do it!

 

[hogheavenfarm]

Re: Setting up a New QMS for Certification when the Standard is about to Change

I would start restructuring now based on most of the draft of 2015, since it incorporates 2008 anyway, what becomes extra baggage (MR, QM, required procedures) can be dealt with easier with elimination later rather than adapting upward. In other words, I would aim for 2015, but retain 2008.
Actually, this is what I did last year, based on the real early sneak peeks, including the new expanded risk/opportunity sections. Once adopted, we should have minimal changes to our system.

 

[John Broomfield]

Re: Setting up a New QMS for Certification when the Standard is about to Change

Process-based organizational management systems need no restructuring to conform to new system standards.

New business objectives and new markets may however result in new processes (and new interactions) and new controls to existing processes.