Shipping Non-Conforming Material under Concession - Who uses the "loophole" in 8.3?

E

energy

Small potatoes, indeed

zibsan said:
Isn’t the real question weather or not you are trying to comply with a regulation or implement the intent of a regulation? I.E. Supplier/Customer partnership.

P.S. For the resistance example of +/- 5 ohms; I would definitely contact the Customer, because it is a functional specification. For the color of the resistor band example; unless I had a requirement to do color matching greater than that of a shade tree, I would make a judgment call.
:bigwave:

That's what I was referring to. Not to indicate that anyone was hanging around with mendacious types. Sheeesh! :bonk:
 
G

Gary L. Phillips - 2007

Agreed...Don't throw caution to the wind on this one! The intent of the standard here is to prevent the abuse of some organizations using the '94 standard to still process/ship n-c product. There now is the requirement to require someone to be held to the fire if she/he decides to continue using a product that has been identified as n-c. Note also that the requirement to segregate the material/items has been moved to the ISO 9004 Guidelines for Improvement. By requireing a documented system which describes who in the organization has the <revelant> authority to issue concessions, including any re-work or repairs needed, if allowed by the customer; folks now must contend with having to offically declare that they have made the decissions necessarily effecting the product/service. These primarily involve internal specifications and requirements.

When a particular n-c product/service does not meet the customer requirements, concession must come from the customer, or the customer's representative, which ever the case. For customer requirements, the revelant authority would not be someone inside the organization, which is why the "and where applicabale" clause is put in the standard.

The first deals with in-house specified requirement n-c, the second deals with external customer specified requirements n-c.

Simply put: form, fit, function, etc, would not absolve an automobile OEM to decide that I will accept a green 4WD pick-up truck when what I ordered was a red one, even though they both would perform as desired, etc.

This issue is probably why a lot of industries will 'down-grade' products and offer these products for sale at a reduced price. :thedeal:
 
Z

zibsan

Gary L. Phillips said:
When a particular n-c product/service does not meet the customer requirements, concession must come from the customer, or the customer's representative, which ever the case. For customer requirements, the revelant authority would not be someone inside the organization, which is why the "and where applicabale" clause is put in the standard.

The first deals with in-house specified requirement n-c, the second deals with external customer specified requirements n-c.
I think you have hit the peverbial nail on the head; in house and customer requirements are 2 issues. The clause is more for the in house.
 
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howste

Thaumaturge
Trusted Information Resource
While looking at the new TC 176 interpretations of ISO 9001:2000 today, I stumbled upon one that looked surprisingly familiar...
Request: ISO 9001:2000 Clause(s:) 8.3
A product is at the final stage of realization and a nonconformity is found on a product related requirement which had been specified by the customer (ISO 9001:2000 7.2.1 a)). The organization believes that the best solution is to accept and deliver the product as is, i.e. with a nonconforming characteristic. The customer has not issued instructions on the reporting of nonconformities.
Does Clause 8.3 require a concession by the customer for the use, release or acceptance as is of the product?
Interpretation: Yes
Rationale: Clause 8.3 identifies three different ways to deal with nonconforming products. Clauses 8.3 a) and c) do not apply in this case. Clause 8.3 b) specifies that the use, release or acceptance shall be authorized. In this case authorization involves a concession by the customer. Furthermore, Clause 5.2 requires that customer requirements are determined and are met.
Is this the part where I say I told you so? :biglaugh:
 
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