Should Loading and Unloading be Included in Cycle Times?

[jaylen001]

In a Mass production unit..making 500 units per 8 hour shift..do we include loading and unloading times of jobs in the Cycle time.

The Production manager has given 15 Seconds for loading and unloading in addition to processing/cutting time of 45 seconds.

A small error in the loading and unloading times gives lot of free time to the operator and OEE is coming as 90-92%.

Also if Loading and unloading times are taken as part of Ideal cycle time how can we take steps to reduce loading and unloading times which is actually a NVA.

Thanks in advance.

 

[qualprod]

In a Mass production unit..making 500 units per 8 hour shift..do we include loading and unloading times of jobs in the Cycle time.

The Production manager has given 15 Seconds for loading and unloading in addition to processing/cutting time of 45 seconds.

A small error in the loading and unloading times gives lot of free time to the operator and OEE is coming as 90-92%.

Also if Loading and unloading times are taken as part of Ideal cycle time how can we take steps to reduce loading and unloading times which is actually a NVA.

Thanks in advance.

Could you explain the task of loading and unloading?
Load and unload what?

 

[qualprod]

In a Mass production unit..making 500 units per 8 hour shift..do we include loading and unloading times of jobs in the Cycle time.

The Production manager has given 15 Seconds for loading and unloading in addition to processing/cutting time of 45 seconds.

A small error in the loading and unloading times gives lot of free time to the operator and OEE is coming as 90-92%.

Also if Loading and unloading times are taken as part of Ideal cycle time how can we take steps to reduce loading and unloading times which is actually a NVA.

Thanks in advance.

In a Mass production unit..making 500 units per 8 hour shift..do we include loading and unloading times of jobs in the Cycle time.

The Production manager has given 15 Seconds for loading and unloading in addition to processing/cutting time of 45 seconds.

A small error in the loading and unloading times gives lot of free time to the operator and OEE is coming as 90-92%.

Also if Loading and unloading times are taken as part of Ideal cycle time how can we take steps to reduce loading and unloading times which is actually a NVA.

Thanks in advance.

It is easy, if loading and unloading are activities needed for the process, should be included into the cycle time.

Why do you say they are nva? If you say that, it could be that they nva, but are needed, thus have to remain there.
Unless they are smed or setup and can be reduced.
Give us a little explanation.

 

[AMIT BALLAL]

@qualprod, I beg to differ with you. Value is defined by the customer, for which the customer is willing to pay. And the customer will only pay for the process (manufacturing process), not loading & unloading.
Identification of NVAs should be done only after defining VAs. Other than VAs, everything is NVA.
Unless you define "Loading, unloading" as waste, no action would be taken on them to either reduce/remove waste. And people will tend to ignore these NVAs as in the case of the poster.

 

[mattador78]

In a Mass production unit..making 500 units per 8 hour shift..do we include loading and unloading times of jobs in the Cycle time.

The Production manager has given 15 Seconds for loading and unloading in addition to processing/cutting time of 45 seconds.

A small error in the loading and unloading times gives lot of free time to the operator and OEE is coming as 90-92%.

Also if Loading and unloading times are taken as part of Ideal cycle time how can we take steps to reduce loading and unloading times which is actually a NVA.

Thanks in advance.

In principal that would depend on the price at quotation dependent upon the job itself. We coat metals and the difficulty of the job to load and unload on to our production line is factored into the price. I appreciate that that varies dependent upon the the process performed and as said above it is the value to the customer so this is made aware here at quotation and contract review

 

[John Predmore]

The cycle time is the start of one machine cycle to the start of the next machine cycle (or use some other reference point in the sequence).

To reduce NVA time for loading and unloading, perhaps the two actions might be done simultaneously, for example, when the operator uses both hands. Perhaps in-going parts could be stacked side-by-side in a track during those seconds when the operator is standing idle, and at the right moment in the cycle, the operator advances the stack so one in-going part moves into the fixture, pushing out the completed part to slide down a chute in the back of the machine. In this way, the time to manually pickup and orient parts, while still a NVA action according the definition offered by @AMIT BALLAL, is done in parallel with the machine cycle and does not add seconds to the overall cycle time. Obviously, I have not seen your parts so this generic idea may not work for your application, but I am offering one idea how load/unload time could be reduced.

 

[outdoorsNW]

In terms of throughput, the non value add vs value add is a distraction. Regardless of which it is, reducing total time required, if it does not cause quality problem or other negative effects, is good. In a machining operation, cutting metal is value add. If the feed rate is increased, processing time will be reduced.

 

[qualprod]

In terms of throughput, the non value add vs value add is a distraction. Regardless of which it is, reducing total time required, if it does not cause quality problem or other negative effects, is good. In a machining operation, cutting metal is value add. If the feed rate is increased, processing time will be reduced.

I wanted to meant in other way.
A NVA, as is defined "What the customer is willing to pay"
But in practice, the customer only "see" the cost in the RFQ, the OTD, quality, and , normally we don´t show to customer all the activities
involved in a product, as to wait an approval of what is NVA or not.
If customer accepts your price and general conditions of the product, that is enough.
Now internally if into your process, you have some activitities which are NVA, ok, is the way you work, nobody
will come to change your process, while you met your customer´s requirements.
It is understandable that you will focus on the NVA in order to improve the process, but is very common that NVA´s exist into the processes because
can´t be easily eliminated, because of the nature of the process or because the change is very costly.
I´m not an expert in this field, but I have seen this happens in manufacturing companies.

Hope it helps

 

[jaylen001]

Could you explain the task of loading and unloading?
Load and unload what?

The machining process involves rings of around 50- 80mm in dia and 30 mm width.. may be 1-2 kg weight per piece.and done in CNC TURNING CENTRES.

 

[qualprod]

The machining process involves rings of around 50- 80mm in dia and 30 mm width.. may be 1-2 kg weight per piece.and done in CNC TURNING CENTRES.

Jay
The more you describe in detail the process the more you will receive some help.
for example.
1. The operator receives the work order, registers the starting in a computer, takes 180 seconds
2- Put the switch ON the machine, 120 seconds
2- Move the raw material from the loading area by using a truck 40 seconds
4- Load the raw material onto the CNC machine
5- Run a setup activity or Chang over C/T (prepare the machine to star cutting)
6-etc.