Should we register to ISO 9001:2008 or ISO 9001:2015?

C

ChrisTGW

#1
I'd appreciate some feedback from the group.....my company is beginning its ISO "Path" this year. We currently are NOT certified to any standard, so assuming 2015 goes "live" in January, 2016, would we have to certify to that Standard if we don't certify to 2008 by 31 December 2015?
 
Elsmar Forum Sponsor
#2
Re: Should we register to ISO 9901:2008 or ISO 9001:2015?

Have not seen the official ruling yet but that would be pretty quick to get up to speed on the new standard. Typically if you are already certified when the new version comes out there is 3 years to upgrade.

I would check with the registrar you are choosing or call a few of them up to ask this question to them. Might be helpful to your cause to get an email or something in writing if they will do that.
 

Helmut Jilling

Auditor / Consultant
#3
I'd appreciate some feedback from the group.....my company is beginning its ISO "Path" this year. We currently are NOT certified to any standard, so assuming 2015 goes "live" in January, 2016, would we have to certify to that Standard if we don't certify to 2008 by 31 December 2015?
No. It is not even a standard yet, so it would be difficult to implement it fully without seeing the final version. You can certify to the current 2008 version for the next couple years... I would build it based on 2008, and upgrade the additional requirements slowly over the next couple years.


Make sure you implement the system correctly, based on processes, and the upgrade will be pretty simple. If you are not clear, send me a private email, or post some questions here. A little professional guidance and training at the beginning would make it a lot smoother.
 

Eredhel

Quality Manager
#4
We are a small shop and had planned on waiting for the 2015 update. But we switched gears and are nearing our 2008 stage I audit. I'm now very glad we are pursuing 2008. Just by getting ready for our internal audits we are nearly ISO compliant and that transition has been smooth and steady. Now we just need a laundry list and we will be comfortable taking the next step. If we had gone ahead with waiting or prepping for 2015 we would not be nearly as far along.
 
M

Mallya

#5
I think the important thing is your plan of action if you plan to get certified in 2015 you better continue with 2008 version and you have a lot of time to upgrade up to 2018.
But if you plan certification in 2016 you better wait 2015 version release.
New version is expected around September with minor changes including introduction of Risk Management issues. So I believe it would easier to update your system by addition of new stuff in 2008 version to get 2015 version.

Benny
 

kzachawk

Involved In Discussions
#6
Chris, if you feel the need to register to an ISO standard, then register to the 2008 version, especially if you are a small business.

I would wait and see if its even feasible for your business to afford to implement the 2015 revision if you determine that to be necessary. The full ramifications of the 2015 revision and its paradigm shift away from quality and into risk management might be far to daunting a task for any small business to undertake. I have spent time with many of the pros who are attempting to setup instruction for the new revision and have discovered that there are issues related to intent which they have not considered.

If you are going to consider the 2015 revision, then read both ISO 31000 and 31010 and discuss those and the DIS version of 9001:2015 with your legal representatives. There could potentially be huge product liability issues related to the 2015 version of ISO 9001.
Quality management systems don't on their own improve quality, that is a decision a business must personally make related to serving its customers (ISO or no ISO). Many companies make the mistake of implementing a QMS, as a means of improving quality, and where there are some prescriptive controls (in 2008 version), it's still the responsibility of the organization to define its customers and their expectations as well as the controls which will be put in place in order to assure those expectations are continually adhered to.

It would be my suggestion to fully understand what your committing your organization to by registering to a prescribed ISO Management System Standard. There will be costs associated with implementing and maintaining such as standard.
 

Sidney Vianna

Post Responsibly
Staff member
Admin
#7
If you are going to consider the 2015 revision, then read both ISO 31000 and 31010 and discuss those and the DIS version of 9001:2015 with your legal representatives. There could potentially be huge product liability issues related to the 2015 version of ISO 9001.
Please provide the requirement from the ISO 9001:2015 DIS that, if remains in the final IS, would create ANY NEW product liability issues.

The vast majority of ISO 9001 certified organizations are small enterprises that have no "legal cousel" or equivalent. As long as any organization is in business, they have product liability risks to contend with. Irrespective of the fact if they follow ISO 9001, or not.

As for the need to read (and understand) ISO 31000 and 31010, it is totally unnecessary, in my opinion.
 

Stijloor

Staff member
Super Moderator
#8
Please provide the requirement from the ISO 9001:2015 DIS that, if remains in the final IS, would create ANY NEW product liability issues.

The vast majority of ISO 9001 certified organizations are small enterprises that have no "legal counsel" or equivalent. As long as any organization is in business, they have product liability risks to contend with. Irrespective of the fact if they follow ISO 9001, or not.

As for the need to read (and understand) ISO 31000 and 31010, it is totally unnecessary, in my opinion.
A LOT more clarification from ISO TC176 is necessary. If not, it's going to be a big mess. Clear interpretations will be needed to aid organizations and auditors. Example? Even after 15 years, the "Process Approach" is still misunderstood.
 

Jen Kirley

Quality and Auditing Expert
Staff member
Admin
#9
For those just starting out now I would recommend sticking to the 2008 version while you can, I think you can migrate to the 2015 version once you have the procedures and other disciplines set.
 

Big Jim

Super Moderator
#10
I echo Stijloor's comment about the process approach still not being very well understood. Until they provide a better definition than something with inputs and outputs that adds value we will still be adrift.

We do know that there will be a three year transition to the new standard. The intent is that most companies will transition when they are due for recertification.

We also know that ISO considers the two standards to be commercially equivalent so you should not be getting customers pushing you to move to the new standard before you are ready.

Additionally we know that the old standard ends in three years, so if an organization gets registered to the old standard after the new one is published, they will not get a full three years of certification.

And another thing we know is that at the end of two years, auditors will no longer be able to audit to the old standard.

Like others have posted, there is no good reason to wait for the new standard. Move ahead now and you will reap the benefits of certification sooner. You will have plenty of time to transition.
 
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