So you are a consultant. Now what?

barb butrym

Quite Involved in Discussions
#1
so you are a consultant, now what?


Ok after visiting a couple other sites and reading posts about consultants and advisors, and adding my notes about trainers, I see there is much confusion in the world about what these people do out there..each consultant has a niche and calls themself what they will. Even Quality Engineers are different from place to place.

Lets discuss job descriptions and see if we can standardize some terms...if only for ourselves here on this forum.... and for kicks and giggles.

What is a consultant? Describe the involvement (role, methods, etc) with a typical ISO 9000 implementation from start to finish.

How does that role correlate to the $$$ charged?

What can the client expect when he deciedes to call in a consultant?

What does the client need to know, and how can he tell which consultant (method)is best for him?

I will now go away and contemplate this, Put on my consultants cap, and return later this evening to provide a response. Anyone else?
 
Elsmar Forum Sponsor

Marc

Hunkered Down for the Duration
Staff member
Admin
#2
You lied. You didn't come back this evening.

But - it's late/early and I have to hit the pillow for a few. I'll put my 10 cents in shortly.
 

Marc

Hunkered Down for the Duration
Staff member
Admin
#3
You said:

"Ok after visiting a couple other sites and reading posts about consultants and advisors..."

Do give us a list of the other sites you visit so we can check them out...
 

barb butrym

Quite Involved in Discussions
#4
sorry...I did come back but I was too hot to come up with a good answer..<LOL>...I was beginning to think no one was listening anyway.

I didn't mean sites...i meant topics...here...again I'm sorry.
 

barb butrym

Quite Involved in Discussions
#5
I will pickone option....

1st step is a Gap analysis.....report the results and do an awareness training showing what is required how to meet the requirements of each element. (trainer role)

2nd step is work with each element team/owner to set the policies, make any needed improvements,direct them in writing the procedures, etc (facilitator role)

3rd step is train the auditors (trainer again)

4th step is proof reader

5th step....preassessment (auditor role)

6th step prep for "real' audit (coach role)

day of audit (observer)

CA response (facilitator again)

Step 2 is where the difference in fee comes in to play......the involvement here is variable. I charge heavy for my poor typing skills to discourage it..BUT it doesn't seem to work <LOL>

Am I a consultant or Advisor?
 

Marc

Hunkered Down for the Duration
Staff member
Admin
#6
A consultant is a piano teacher. The goal is to teach the client how to play on their own. A good piano teacher does a good job. A bad piano teacher can cause irrepairable (spelling...) harm.

Costs? Fees? Mine range from US$50/Hr to US$1500 a day. So many considerations. How many days? Local or travel? International? Size of company? Systems complexity?

The client's first problem is to decide what s/he needs/wants. What is goal. Financial position/expectations. Clients should expect in large part what they communicate that they need/want to the consultant.

I guess I'm far from any answers here for most of these because every client is different. From prices to requirements... And as time goes on I find myself taking different directions to deal with different road blocks. Methods are different with diffrent customers. I have had some customers which wanted me to 'stay in town, just in case'. Others expected me to be out there writing process documentation. Every day a new challange.

On the other hand there are Excel or Perry Johnson types. Very structured and regimented.

I do in general go along with your list as a general implementation roadmap.
 

barb butrym

Quite Involved in Discussions
#7
I agree that each job is so very different...trouble I find is the client rarely knows what they want...they think they know...but in the end...they really rely on me to tell them what they need and should want.

My fees are the same ... usually figured out as a project total....except for some repeat clients (that want me hanging around) that pay me for invoiced time.

All in all as my box of tricks gets bigger, the job gets easier...I am more effective and I find I spend less time doing the project....ergo more $$ for actual hours spent...
 

barb butrym

Quite Involved in Discussions
#8
I do enjoy the teaching role best...so naturally my speciality is training....Each in-house session is painstakenly tailored to the client. Each public session is tailored for "use"...in that delegates will use what they learn....during the sessions...to bring home the concept.
 

barb butrym

Quite Involved in Discussions
#9
Its cooler today...i can think <LOL>

Now for the next approach: A group of companies want a low cost approach to implementation, so they group together in a collabrative. (reimbursed by most state governments for nearly all costs)

The consultant holds periodic workshops breaking down the standard into hunks..a couple of "on site" advisory days....charges a fee for each company..rakes in a bundle and gets 'additional consulting ' time cause each company takes him aside and says "help me, i'm lost" And ZERO guarantee. Runs 10 groups at a time.....10 companies to a group...a fast, ummmmm lets do the math 8-10 K each...times 10...100K times 10 at a time..800K-$1 million for 10-15 days work a month.10 months....really??????? What is the cost excluding labor for something like that...copies of handouts, and a couple disks. Space may or may not be a factor.. I know some that do the workshops on site at each of the 10 companies..as part of the 'on site time' and the company picks up lunch !!! Worse case.....100 a day...or 1000 a group for space...lunch optional.

A little tough on the consultant wasn't I? sorry ...saw too many fallouts from this approach....No doubt a product of a lousy teacher or a company not set up for this type of method, not the fault of the approach.

I actually like the approach, just have not seen success unless the company is a company that would have done well anyway, and just needed focus .....it needs the right combination of people.....teacher and company..and NO-ONE I have seem addresses that. I do small adaptations, as I will take a couple of my clients and group them for certain sessions if I think they may benefit from each others input..and some sessions work better with a larger group.

What is the general opinion of this approach out there? PRO and CON..show me some success stories......
 
S

scumaci

#10
No one has had any consulting questions for awhile, so I will broach the subject again. Having been project manager on two successful ISO-9000 implementation project, a family friend, owner of an decal manufacturer, has asked me to review their quality system. My question is, what type of considerations should I raise prior to accepting this paid role (off-hours and weekends). I want to be truly fair to him and myself. Thanks for the input (advise?)
 
Thread starter Similar threads Forum Replies Date
L AS 9100 D consultant in Delhi, India AS9100, IAQG, NADCAP and Aerospace related Standards and Requirements 1
D ISO 9001 & AS9100 Certificate issued by a consultant for a Distributor Registrars and Notified Bodies 11
S MDR consultants - in search of recommendations for a consultant for MDR transition. Paid Consulting, Training and Services 7
A ISMS - Seeking VAPT Consultant Food Safety - ISO 22000, HACCP (21 CFR 120) 1
William55401 How Often Does FDA State Consultant Recommended in a Pharma WL? US Food and Drug Administration (FDA) 1
H Looking for Tips on finding an IATF consultant Consultants and Consulting 6
L ISO 13485 5.5.2 - Can a consultant be our Management Representative ISO 13485:2016 - Medical Device Quality Management Systems 5
D Clinical Evaluation Report - Consultant Recommendations Consultants and Consulting 9
M Internal audit consultant ISO 13485 (English speaker) Consultants and Consulting 3
P Consultant Auditing Qualifications Requirements ISO 9000, ISO 9001, and ISO 9004 Quality Management Systems Standards 23
N Is consultant prohibited in ISO9001 audit? ISO 9000, ISO 9001, and ISO 9004 Quality Management Systems Standards 66
N Is ISO14001 consultant allowed to attend ISO14001 audit? ISO 14001:2015 Specific Discussions 17
S ISO 13485 Consultant Question - The company has 5 part time employees ISO 13485:2016 - Medical Device Quality Management Systems 1
C Specification Developer or Consultant? Definitions 21 CFR Part 820 - US FDA Quality System Regulations (QSR) 1
R Who here is Using a Consultant for ISO 9001 Transition? ISO 9000, ISO 9001, and ISO 9004 Quality Management Systems Standards 2
A Setting up an LLC as a Consultant Paid Consulting, Training and Services 27
K Sister Company Moving to AS - First time "consultant" - Help? AS9100, IAQG, NADCAP and Aerospace related Standards and Requirements 17
S Can anyone share a Consultant Proposal for QMS Remediation? Consultants and Consulting 5
T IATF Certified Auditor/Consultant Wanted in the Evansville, Indiana Area Consultants and Consulting 0
M Can a Consultant be the main contact for a Medical Device Company? Other Medical Device and Orthopedic Related Topics 6
F Cost of hiring ISO 17025 Consultant to Build Laboratory From Scratch ISO 17025 related Discussions 6
J Is getting a UDI Consultant a good idea? Other Medical Device Regulations World-Wide 4
E Consultant Person who implemented ALSO the Registrar Auditor? Consultants and Consulting 17
H How to find a good ISO 9001 Implementation Consultant in Calgary, Canada? ISO 9000, ISO 9001, and ISO 9004 Quality Management Systems Standards 9
P How to deal with a Recruitment Consultant Career and Occupation Discussions 3
A Creative ways to access Expert Information when you can't afford a top $ Consultant Misc. Quality Assurance and Business Systems Related Topics 7
S Design and Development Document evidence for Engineering Consultant ISO 9000, ISO 9001, and ISO 9004 Quality Management Systems Standards 3
P FDA QSR Inspection Consultant Recommendations 21 CFR Part 820 - US FDA Quality System Regulations (QSR) 11
L Mock Audit by External Consultant (ISO 13485) 21 CFR Part 820 - US FDA Quality System Regulations (QSR) 8
S GDPMD MALAYSIA Consultant and what they teach Other Medical Device Regulations World-Wide 14
Jen Kirley This international consultant thing sure is a ride! Career and Occupation Discussions 13
R Ethical Aspects while being Consultant and Certifier within same Organization. Consultants and Consulting 6
M Can an Auditor introduce a Consultant to help fix NCs after the audit? General Auditing Discussions 12
G Has anyone used shlomo Aviv-lean consultant? Lean in Manufacturing and Service Industries 1
E What are the major difficulties when working as a consultant in your industry? Consultants and Consulting 20
S Advice on becoming an ISO Management Systems Consultant ISO 9000, ISO 9001, and ISO 9004 Quality Management Systems Standards 25
C Medical Device Regulatory Consultant in Mexico Other Medical Device Regulations World-Wide 3
P Can an outside consultant audit all the AS9100 requirements including Internal Audit? AS9100, IAQG, NADCAP and Aerospace related Standards and Requirements 24
R ISO 17025 Accreditation - Need for consultant? ISO 17025 related Discussions 10
JoCam Reputable, UK based Consultant for the Health & Safety standard OHSAS 18001 Consultants and Consulting 14
I How to measure the performance of ISO 9001 Consultant? Consultants and Consulting 9
R Charge (Fair Prices) by a Consultant for a traditional 510k Review Other US Medical Device Regulations 2
P Medical Device Consultant Professional Liability Insurance (O & E) Career and Occupation Discussions 5
N Consultant Obligations, CFR 803 and Sterility Quality Manager and Management Related Issues 4
S FDA Consultant Needed for Class I Medical Device Development 21 CFR Part 820 - US FDA Quality System Regulations (QSR) 3
Q Best consultant for Predicted MTBF consulting service using Telcordia standard Reliability Analysis - Predictions, Testing and Standards 3
Stijloor Consultant/Auditor needed in New York State Food Safety - ISO 22000, HACCP (21 CFR 120) 1
L Consultant not following Process Approach ISO 9000, ISO 9001, and ISO 9004 Quality Management Systems Standards 34
Stijloor Looking for a competent MSA Instructor/Consultant Gage R&R (GR&R) and MSA (Measurement Systems Analysis) 1
J Can a consultant outside of the USA be a contact person on 510k? Other US Medical Device Regulations 13

Similar threads

Top Bottom