Subsidiary - No Managing Director - Is ISO 9001 Certification Possible?

B

bbecker

#1
Dear forum-contributors,
I recently joined this great forum, after having "only" read it for several years.
In my acting role as QMR in a German subsidiary of a Spanish Mother company I am asking myself:

- there is no permanent Managing Director installed in the German location any more nor are there sufficient empowered employees installed (after shares were sold from Germany to Spain): how to apply Clause 5 - Management responsibility? My understanding is that there is a strong need to maintain the fully outstretched QM-system to the German organization. Without "somebody" in charge the chapters 5.1, to 5.6 are w/o foundation.

- some key processes (Risk Analysis, Data Security, Legal Services, ...) are now solely located in the Spain Mother company: is is still conceivable to maintain the German 9001-certification?

- both companies are certified (from different bodies) but in different scope (one manufacturing-biased, one biased in detailled engineering): what about future (when certificates rundown)? In case of a marriage of both systems, what is the mandatory effort to be done?


Thanks for all your answers!
Un saludo,

 
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#3
Dear forum-contributors,
I recently joined this great forum, after having "only" read it for several years.
In my acting role as QMR in a German subsidiary of a Spanish Mother company I am asking myself:

- there is no permanent Managing Director installed in the German location any more nor are there sufficient empowered employees installed (after shares were sold from Germany to Spain): how to apply Clause 5 - Management responsibility? My understanding is that there is a strong need to maintain the fully outstretched QM-system to the German organization. Without "somebody" in charge the chapters 5.1, to 5.6 are w/o foundation.

- some key processes (Risk Analysis, Data Security, Legal Services, ...) are now solely located in the Spain Mother company: is is still conceivable to maintain the German 9001-certification?
Welcome to the cove bbecker (Boris?) :bigwave: As described I would say the German site doesn't have sufficient autonomy to maintain an independent certification to 9001 but my guess is you will be able to make a case and retain it - if you want to.

You need to consider your options and decide which is best for you:
  • Keep separate certificates with two different CBs
  • Transfer certification to the CB of your Spanish site
  • Move to a single certificate covering both sites

The actions are as follows:
  • Starting with your existing QMS look at what has 'gone' and where and how those requirements are being met. Document them as outsourced and put in place some controls to show you review they are being done. Throw in an internal audit of the Spanish site and that should be enough
  • You need to do the first bit in the bullet above but then the Spanish site CB can look at interfaces and ensure your internal supplier is carrying out the activities for the German site when they do their 3rd party audit there
  • Big rewrite of both systems but you'll probably end up with a better system as you consider some of the processes you listed and how they work across functional and geographic boundaries.
- both companies are certified (from different bodies) but in different scope (one manufacturing-biased, one biased in detailled engineering): what about future (when certificates rundown)? In case of a marriage of both systems, what is the mandatory effort to be done?


Thanks for all your answers!
Un saludo,

The options are endless. At any point in the 3 year certification cycle you can move your certification from one CB to another. You can transfer to either of your current providers or find a new one.

Carry on posting if you want more or at least let us know how you get on! :D
 
J

Johndeere42

#4
A strict reading of the ISO/AS standard only says that top management shall appoint a member of management; so if the two companies are under one management umbrella, I would imagine some creative wording in a apponitment letter would suffice. " Mr. John Smith, of ( Spanish site) is also the Management Represntative of ( German site). "
The standards do not define how this is done, only what needs done.

Good Luck.
 
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