Supplier Control in TS 16949 - How to spice up my Internal Audit questions

[fuzzy]

Re: Supplier Control in TS

The approved Vendor list ist just one of the requirements in our Procedure. The other requirements in Supplier Control are: on-time delivery, ISO/TS certification, quality and quantity of Product all of which is stated on the PO.
So the procedure is covering all of this, it was the approved Vendor list that threw me off.
I also would like to know, how you all handle the situation of getting a updated Certificate from Suppliers, to keep your files up to date. I have started that project 5 months ago, since it was neglected from the former QM, and have gotten a dozen or so of new Certifications back. But I still have a few companys which have not, I know this is trivial to some of them and the request usually gets put on the bottom of the file, but eventually they have to get to the buttom of the file and see that I am still waiting on a response. Send them a second notice? Telling them that we won't buy material from them since we don't have a Certificate from them, does not work, since most of our suppliers are Custoemr requested Supplier or the Supplier is the only one you can get that particular material from.

I may be a little rusty in the TS world but it seems to me that you could write an exception to your TS / ISO requirements only for customer-specified or single-source suppliers, as in both cases you as the supplier will have no option to find a different supplier in these cases. I would assume that your customer will always have to waive the TS requirement for the minimum ISO certiifed suppliers, come PPAP time. Anyone else agree or what?

 

[Sidney Vianna]

Warm from the oven

SI 5 06 - ISO/TS 169494:2002 7.4.1.2 Supplier quality management system development
(New, adopted December 2006)

The organization shall perform supplier quality management system development with the goal of supplier conformity with this Technical Specification. Conformity with ISO 9001:2000 demonstrated by a certification by an accredited third party certification/registration body or through a second party audit process is the first step in achieving this goal.

The organization’s second party audit process shall be consistent with the automotive process approach, including evidence of planning, supplier readiness and supplier performance. (See also ISO 17021:2006), Section 9. In addition, the second party process shall be defined according to the principles detailed in the sections 5, 6, 7 of the ISO 19011:2002 regarding the management of the audit program, the audit activities and the competence of the auditors. Records of the audits reports shall be maintained.
After the initial audit, the second party surveillance audits shall be conducted at least annually.
The prioritization of suppliers for development depends upon, for example, the supplier’s quality performance and the importance of the product supplied.
The organization shall have decision criteria for determining “specially designated small suppliers” wherein certain specified elements of ISO 9001:2000 or ISO/TS 16949: 2002 may be waived. Records of the established criteria and decision taken accordingly shall be maintained. “Small” here above may refer to the volume supplied to the automotive industry or to the organization .
Refer to OEM Vehicle Manufacturer customer specifics for 2nd Party audit requirements for the organization who is a direct supplier to the OEM.

 

[Icy Mountain]

Re: Supplier Control in TS

Evaluating and approving the REGISTRARS.

Of course they will also be subject to re-evaluation and vendor ratings just as other suppliers are. No repeat orders will be drawn on them unless they supply proof of validity of their accreditation.
Wow! I just imagine somebody telling a CB that their last audit has not been upto the mark. They better improve in the next round, or else...
Thats great Ralph. Do you really do all these things? How I wish we all do it!!

We do something very similar. Database with Supplier Name, QMS system registration, cert. expiration date, # of Supplier Action Requests issued, # of late deliveries. Proof of development and it's a nice summary to show you where effort needs applied.

As for evaluating registrars, we started with 8, and whittled down to 1 before issuing a contract. You can bet your bippy that they would be an ex-supplier if they lost their ANAB or IATF accreditation. Sending an auditor that can't tell a resistor from an IC, but has 20 years experience in the metal stamping industry, would also start a rather unpleasant process of supplier corrective action.

As for spicing up audit questions: I have seen everything from the standard "how's the wife and kids" to actual magic tricks used to keep audits from getting dull. Both you and your auditee have a job to perform in keeping up the quality system. That doesn't mean you can't have a little fun. As an auditor, you should be a feedback loop that keeps your quality management system from getting out of control. You should not be a finding generator. If your manual is compliant with TS and everyone is doing things in a way that is compliant with your manual, document the facts while finding out how life is going for your auditee. If they like jokes, tell a joke. If pulling a rabbit out of your hat would entertain them, do it!

At my last company, my lead internal auditor was probably the most popular person in the company. She would actually ask auditees how things were going, at work and at home. Everything relating to the QMS went into the audit report. Plenty of things that were well outside the system (e.g. Mary's boss treats her like dirt and might be stealing customers) went in to a far less formal report that she and I discussed. We would look for ways to help. Finally, she kept her own journal of everyone's personal issues so at the next audit, she could ask whether Johnny got accepted to Yale, how little Susie is doing after the tonsillectomy or whether Mary's boss is treating her better these days.

All work and no play makes Icy a dull boy!

 

[try2makeit]

Thanks Icy for your reply. I have just about done everything that you described, for the exception of pulling a Rabbit out of a hat.

I have audited everyone here many times, so I basically know already how to approach them. Some of them get really defensive when they see you coming, so you start to talk about daily stuff with them first before you go " Now can you tell me what you are doing here?"

Others, I bring a cup of Coffee to butter them up, to others I can approach them by making joke about me needing to learn about his job.

Anyway, thanks for the ideas all of you suggested, I appreciate it.