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Supplier Selection - ISO 9001 Clause 7.4.1 - Need Help

Q

qualityqueen1974

#1
Hello, My name is Andrea Hall. This is my first post besides the introduction. I have spent the last few hours absorbing information in regard to Supplier evaluation but have still come up short on the selection questions I have. My company is currently preparing for ISO registration in June. We had our pre-audit yesterday and the comment from the auditor was that our supplier selection criteria is not adequately defined. I agree but I am stuck.

I have a procedure which we have titled Supplier Evaluation. View attachment QOP-74-01-A Rev 3 Supplier Evaluation.doc I hope the attachment worked. I knew there would be a problem with the procedure for ISO registration but since this was just the pre-audit I didnt try to kill myself to fix it before this visit. I do have to fix it before the registration audit.

Here is where I am stuck:

Selection of new suppliers is a big deal. Our commodity is in the semi-conductor industry so preciseness is very important with components that affect fit, form, or function. We are also limited in the suppliers we can use since our customers provide us with specific BOM requirements. Our AVL classifies suppliers as Direct Material-OEM, Direct Material BTP, and Indirect Consumables. Our procedure doesnt define how to add a supplier to the AVL. I am a crossroad with my Materials Director because he thinks he should just be able to add whomever he wants based on his own evaluation...which is not defined. I think that New Suppliers should at least complete a Supplier Profile View attachment AIT Supplier Survey Draft.xls . I found a survey on this forum and modified it with additional things I thought were important for a supplier profile. My questions are:

a. If a new supplier is given the survey prior to PO issue, what is a good objective way to analyze the information? I tried applying a scoring system to it but got stuck.

b. If the answers are all satisfactory, do you think it would be too much more to ask for a first article for the first build of the first PO before additional POs are issued?

c. Is it too complicated to require suppliers to fill out a survey and give me one good part before we add them to the AVL?

d. Do providers of Indirect consumables need to be subjected to the same survey/quality requirement? It seems silly to me that I would make Home Depot fill out a survey if we buy shop consumables from there.In this same regard, would Home Depot need to be on the AVL?

I am sorry that this is so long and I hope that my attachments come through. Thanks in advance for your help, andrea.
 
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Coury Ferguson

Moderator here to help
Staff member
Super Moderator
#2
Re: 7.4.1 Supplier Selection...Need Help

Hello, My name is Andrea Hall. This is my first post besides the introduction. I have spent the last few hours absorbing information in regard to Supplier evaluation but have still come up short on the selection questions I have. My company is currently preparing for ISO registration in June. We had our pre-audit yesterday and the comment from the auditor was that our supplier selection criteria is not adequately defined. I agree but I am stuck.

I have a procedure which we have titled Supplier Evaluation. View attachment 8550 I hope the attachment worked. I knew there would be a problem with the procedure for ISO registration but since this was just the pre-audit I didnt try to kill myself to fix it before this visit. I do have to fix it before the registration audit.

Here is where I am stuck:

Selection of new suppliers is a big deal. Our commodity is in the semi-conductor industry so preciseness is very important with components that affect fit, form, or function. We are also limited in the suppliers we can use since our customers provide us with specific BOM requirements. Our AVL classifies suppliers as Direct Material-OEM, Direct Material BTP, and Indirect Consumables. Our procedure doesnt define how to add a supplier to the AVL. I am a crossroad with my Materials Director because he thinks he should just be able to add whomever he wants based on his own evaluation...which is not defined. I think that New Suppliers should at least complete a Supplier Profile View attachment 8551 . I found a survey on this forum and modified it with additional things I thought were important for a supplier profile. My questions are:

a. If a new supplier is given the survey prior to PO issue, what is a good objective way to analyze the information? I tried applying a scoring system to it but got stuck.

b. If the answers are all satisfactory, do you think it would be too much more to ask for a first article for the first build of the first PO before additional POs are issued?

c. Is it too complicated to require suppliers to fill out a survey and give me one good part before we add them to the AVL?

d. Do providers of Indirect consumables need to be subjected to the same survey/quality requirement? It seems silly to me that I would make Home Depot fill out a survey if we buy shop consumables from there.In this same regard, would Home Depot need to be on the AVL?

I am sorry that this is so long and I hope that my attachments come through. Thanks in advance for your help, andrea.
Welcome Andrea. Your attachments are there. :bigwave:


As to your questions:

a. If a new supplier is given the survey prior to PO issue, what is a good objective way to analyze the information? I tried applying a scoring system to it but got stuck.
The first thing to do is, validate that the information provided is accurate and concise to the company's needs. If necessary, I would make a visit to the potential supplier and look at their processes and capabilities.

b. If the answers are all satisfactory, do you think it would be too much more to ask for a first article for the first build of the first PO before additional POs are issued?
Yes asking for a first article would be appropriate and expected. Once the data and part(s) have been received, validate/verify the results to assure that they meet the specification/design requirements.

c. Is it too complicated to require suppliers to fill out a survey and give me one good part before we add them to the AVL?
Not at all. If they want the business, they should not have any problems with completing the survey, and providing the First Article. I would place them on "conditional" status until the requirements are met.

d. Do providers of Indirect consumables need to be subjected to the same survey/quality requirement? It seems silly to me that I would make Home Depot fill out a survey if we buy shop consumables from there.In this same regard, would Home Depot need to be on the AVL?
That would be based upon what the company wants and needs. As for the Home Depot...I most likely wouldn't place them on the approved supplier list, unless, product is purchased that affect the product furnished to your customer.

I am sorry that this is so long and I hope that my attachments come through. Thanks in advance for your help, andrea.
Don't worry about the length of the post. The information provided was well thought out and planned. The better clarification of the issue(s), the better responses that will be provided.
 
Q

qualityqueen1974

#3
Re: 7.4.1 Supplier Selection...Need Help

Thanks very much Coury. I appreciate your super fast response.
 

somashekar

Staff member
Super Moderator
#4
Re: 7.4.1 Supplier Selection...Need Help

Hello, My name is Andrea Hall. This is my first post besides the introduction. I have spent the last few hours absorbing information in regard to Supplier evaluation but have still come up short on the selection questions I have. My company is currently preparing for ISO registration in June. We had our pre-audit yesterday and the comment from the auditor was that our supplier selection criteria is not adequately defined. I agree but I am stuck.

I have a procedure which we have titled Supplier Evaluation. View attachment 8550 I hope the attachment worked. I knew there would be a problem with the procedure for ISO registration but since this was just the pre-audit I didnt try to kill myself to fix it before this visit. I do have to fix it before the registration audit.

Here is where I am stuck:

Selection of new suppliers is a big deal. Our commodity is in the semi-conductor industry so preciseness is very important with components that affect fit, form, or function. We are also limited in the suppliers we can use since our customers provide us with specific BOM requirements. Our AVL classifies suppliers as Direct Material-OEM, Direct Material BTP, and Indirect Consumables. Our procedure doesnt define how to add a supplier to the AVL. I am a crossroad with my Materials Director because he thinks he should just be able to add whomever he wants based on his own evaluation...which is not defined. I think that New Suppliers should at least complete a Supplier Profile View attachment 8551 . I found a survey on this forum and modified it with additional things I thought were important for a supplier profile. My questions are:

a. If a new supplier is given the survey prior to PO issue, what is a good objective way to analyze the information? I tried applying a scoring system to it but got stuck.

b. If the answers are all satisfactory, do you think it would be too much more to ask for a first article for the first build of the first PO before additional POs are issued?

c. Is it too complicated to require suppliers to fill out a survey and give me one good part before we add them to the AVL?

d. Do providers of Indirect consumables need to be subjected to the same survey/quality requirement? It seems silly to me that I would make Home Depot fill out a survey if we buy shop consumables from there.In this same regard, would Home Depot need to be on the AVL?

I am sorry that this is so long and I hope that my attachments come through. Thanks in advance for your help, andrea.
Hii Andrea.
For a supplier part combination, I would set one or more of the following selection criteria ...
1. Being an existing supplier and records of continued accepted supplies (Ex. last 3 deliveries)
2. Recommended by your Customer / Desing (BOM references for records)
3. Authorized distributors of recommended parts either by customer or design. (Records of authorization from OEM / distributor and its continued validity )
4. Based on supplier assessment team visit and recommendation and approval of sample or pilot supplies (Your internal completed assessment forms + sample or pilot supplies approval reports)
5. Requirement of quality management system certification of the supplie or such other certification of product safety like UL mark / CSA mark for critical components (Customer or Design need to specify based on your product requirement)
Further I would add the selected criteria or combination of criteria in the AVL for the supplier part combination and maintain appropriate records as said in Sl. 1. to 5. above.

This has worked well for me. Does it sound simple and logical for you ?

Good luck ....
 
#5
Andrea - Welcome!

A dilemma for sure! No, your boss can't just add suppliers - you're correct.

However, IMHO, neither does having a survey do much more than put a form to the same process. Looking over the one you have there appears to be no weighting applied to any of the questions (unless that's in the procedures) so, the supplier doesn't know the score. And, frankly, not all the criterai listed make much sense for all suppliers.:nope:

Having been in the SQA side of the business, I learned that suppliers don't fill out surveys unless they know there's an order at the end or they treat them with contempt (I know I did!).;)

You know all you need to know about supplier selection. We all do it at sometime in our own lives (and screw it up too, but that's another subject):lol:

Put in a context you're somewhat familiar with, how would you approach dealing with a store in your local town if you'd never shopped there before?

You could go in,walk around, see what the place has, how clean/tidy it is etc. and speak to the staff (that's auditing).

You could ask someone you know/trust what their experience has been. You could buy something and decide based on a small/limited experience (first article).

Of course, if they are ISO compliant that helps, but it still isn't much more than a differentiator from another unreg. store. But it helps if you have a problem or you can get a warm & fuzzy that they have a sysem.

As you said, if the customer tells you 'go to this store' then you will, but you still have to keep an eye on their performance.

If you mailed them a survey, they probably wouldn't respond or do so inaccurately, so you won't learn much about them.

Here's your criteria. I'd pitch the survey and write this stuff into your procedures.......
 

aurel

Starting to get Involved
#6
Your general approach is good. By the way, nice procedure.

Regarding your questions pls. check the previous posts. Try a search. You will find some interesting opinions.

Also pls. consider that it is quite hard to evaluate and than re-evaluate all your suppliers with a single set of rules. Some are more important – their products are critical for you, others less. So, try a less rigid approach. For instance ask your Materials Director for help. It is one the procedure he is going to use on a regular basis. (By the way see: http://elsmar.com/pdf_files/ISO%209000%20Implementation.ppt - it’s a good one!)

In this way, your scoring system might work better and this will answer to you’re a, b and d questions. Regarding c – it’s not complicated, but you can do it yourself if you got some data and if it is such a big deal. You must focus on your task: evaluate and re-evaluate your suppliers that affect the product furnished to your customer.

Good luck for your registration!
 
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