Tape Measure Verification - Starrett 72" certified steel rule

SteelMaiden

Super Moderator
Super Moderator
#11
By the way, do you really have to calibrate your standard every two years, or would it suffice to simply verify the condition is still pristine?
Since that is the one that all else is verified against, it would be hard to justify not looking at it periodically. Our customers expect it, we are audited to some pretty heavy duty standards with legal and regulatory requirements. (nuclear) It is easier to do it with some of our other 2 year stuff is being done.
 
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Jim Wynne

Staff member
Admin
#12
By the way, do you really have to calibrate your standard every two years, or would it suffice to simply verify the condition is still pristine?
There's nothing in evidence at this point to indicate that the "certified" master has been properly calibrated (e.g., to traceable standards), which is why I asked the OP earlier what "certified" means.
 

Helmut Jilling

Auditor / Consultant
#13
There's nothing in evidence at this point to indicate that the "certified" master has been properly calibrated (e.g., to traceable standards), which is why I asked the OP earlier what "certified" means.
I understood the OP comment to indicate that the master 72" rule was a "certified" master issued by Starrett. Everything else would of course hinge on that.
 
A

andygr

#14
The only concern I could see is "stretching" causing the length to be off- especialy in a rough enviroment. I belive that you cover it with the visual inspection as to impact enough to affect you 3/16 should show something I would think.
:2cents:
 
J

Jessic2952

#15
The master 72" rule I use is certified by Starrett; I would type out everything on the certificate but basically it states it is traceable to NIST standards. I was only going to "calibrate" the 72" rule every 5 years -- and let Starrett do that.
As far as stretching goes, I don't see that happening beyond 1/16 of an inch since we're not tugging on the things and it doesn't get that hot... besides the material is full hard steel; it would be hard to stretch!
I'm glad to see that so many of you guys are in agreement with me!!! I knew I wasn't being noncompliant. The external auditor with SRI even said so.:thanx:
 

Hershal

Metrologist-Auditor
Staff member
Super Moderator
#16
I would like some advice from someone (anyone) who can let me know if my current practices for tape measure verification is sufficient for the TS 16949 standard....

Background info:
Tape measures are used to measure the widths of steel coils. This measurement goes on the customer's paperwork. Steel coils range in widths from 35" to 65". Tightest width tolerance (per ASTM requirements) is 3/16".


Current practice:
1. When new tapes arrive at our facility (Komelon brand), they are pulled out against a Starrett 72" certified steel rule. Each inch increment is verified for accuracy, then issued to operators on the shop floor.

2. The operators inspect the tapes at the beginning of each 12-hour shift for any damage such as kinks, wear and tear, etc, that would invalidate measurement results. During this inspection, they also test the accuracy of the tape's end piece with a certified Mitutoyo 1" gage block. If there is any kind of damage along the operating range of the tape or the end piece, they are instructed to discard the tapes and get a new one.

3. If the tapes last that long (mill environments can be rough!), then the tapes are brought back to the lab and pulled out against the 72" certified rule again after 2 years. If they pass, they are reissued; if not, they are disposed of and corrective action is taken place if it is suspected that material has been measured incorrectly.


Suggested practice by QMS dept:
The 1" block is not enough. Instead, operators should be using certified 72" steel rules at each shift (instead of the 2-year interval currently in place).


Arguments against suggested practice by QMS:
1. The certified steel rules are relatively expensive ($600-700 each), compared to the 1" blocks (about $15 each).
2. MSA studies (specifically stability) has indicated that the current process is stable enough to not require modification to the 2-year verification interval on the 72" rule.
3. Claims/complaint/internal hold data does not suggest any width issues arising from out-of-spec tape measures.
4. It's a tape measure, for goodness sakes. If it's good when you bought it and doesn't become damaged, then it remains good.


If anyone can point me to a clause in any standard or ISO guidance material where our current practices are noncompliant, then please do so. I am also a TS 16949:2002 certified lead auditor; I'm not sure why QMS department is unsatisfied with our verification process for tapes. I have also searched ISO 10012:2003 and have found nothing in there that suggests we are noncompliant. Am I overlooking something somewhere?
HELP!!
I can't speak to the TS-16949.....only to the metrological aspect.....

First question, for your Starrett master rule, is it at once anchored and calibrated by an external and ISO/IEC 17025 accredited calibration laboratory? If not, then you may have significant questions to answer to your auditor.....

Verification using gage blocks is also OK, except now you need to include wringing for each time you move the block (typically accepted as 0.00005") per wringing.....

Oh, and you should - even for verification - calculate your uncertainty, not to report, it is verification after all, but YOU need to know what the error is in a given measurement.....that is what uncertainty tells you.....

Now, let's get real.....you measure to 3/16" which is not far distant from the most believable limit of a tape measure.....a decent tape can be accpeted to - at best - 1/16" as then one gets into the width of the marking and so forth.....so 3/16" is basically pushing the limit a bit.....but you are still good.....so verify your tapes to 1/8".....

I would put the tapes on a MUCH tighter schedule for verification, a quarter at most.....not two years.....your statement regarding wearing is a good evidence of that.....

Hope this helps.....

Hershal
 

Helmut Jilling

Auditor / Consultant
#17
I can't speak to the TS-16949.....only to the metrological aspect.....

First question, for your Starrett master rule, is it at once anchored and calibrated by an external and ISO/IEC 17025 accredited calibration laboratory? If not, then you may have significant questions to answer to your auditor........Hope this helps.....

Hershal
Starrett has acquired and maintained ISO/IEC 17025 accreditation for the last few years...possibly as a result of the TS requirement.
 
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