The ISO 9001:2008 addendum - What would you like to add or subtract?

[Peter Fraser]

1 Remove silly Notes such as "a driver's manual is software".

2 Explain why things are required - eg why is a quality manual required.

 

[Ajit Basrur]

I would like to have this standard FREE

 

[JaneB]

Was a customer complaint raised? Did corrective action follow?? Did pigs fly???

In this particular case, the latter I think .
Re. the client - they responded to the certifier/registrar's request for feedback. Let's just say that if I or any other customer-focussed business I can think of had got feedback like that (which was very politely & professionally expressed, but raised some serious concerns) I'd have been on the phone to them within 5 minutes. They haven't received any response whatsoever. Zip. Zilch. Zero. Nada. Nil.

But, is that always the case? No. It says a lot about that particular one (as did the standard of their auditors.) But I refuse to take that as representative of all auditing certifiers. I've complained to a different one: and got such a professional, concerned and overall satisfactory response that I was blown away, as well as seriously revising my opinion of them as an organisation. And, yes, corrective and preventive action occurred too!



OK, I'll get off my soapbox now.

My point? We can't & should not tar all auditing bodies (nor auditors) with the same black brush. It's too simplistic and not true.

 

[JaneB]

I would like to have this standard FREE

Sure. And I'd like free food, free wine, free housing, free everything.

No such thing as a free lunch.

And ultimately... with free, you gets what you pays for.

 

[Madfox]

Survey says...

(I think the discussion got a bit off track above...)

#1
Rename 7.5 to read "Product" provision (or something like that). Many newbies think that since they don't provide "service after the sale" that many parts of 7.5 don't apply. (I saw a quote where the company wanted to exclude all of 7.5!...I'd like to have met their consultant!)

#2
The silly intro paragraphs like 8.1/8.5.1/6.1/5.1/4.1 (among others). Just put the text under the main number, don't make it a stand alone sub clause.

#3
Clarify 7.5.2

#4
Make 4.1's reference to "outsource processes" more than just a seemlingly note.

#5
Make 7.4.1 more user friendly (or at least to read).
(And, to all CB's, more easily excludable. What's a grinding shop have to buy except for off-the-shelf grinding wheels and lube? "Well, they've got to be buying something. Have they established "criteria for their phone and internet services? Fedex or UPS, Staples or Office Depot?")

#6
7.3.5-7.3.7
Oh, great for those in the chain declaring Chap 11 daily, but not "mom & pop" friendly!

#7
8.5.3 (ref 8.4 c)
If PA's are only valid if derived from data analysis regarding trends (which I agree with), put that portion in the paragraph!!

#8
4.2.3/4.2.4
Stress relevence to the QMS, product, and customer requirements. I've actually gotten an inquiry regarding the QP's posting not being controlled!
("Sorry, the cherry picker's broken and I really don't want five people holding a ladder while I check out the banner for its rev level!")
Seems finding uncontrolled docs/records is the tool for the auditing novice or conference room commando.

Madfox

 

[David M McInerney]

The clause for 7.4 Purchasing needs to be reworded to eliminate the redundancy.

 

[Sidney Vianna]

The clause for 7.4 Purchasing needs to be reworded to eliminate the redundancy.

What redundancy?

 

[Colin]

Clause 4.2.1 is my pet hate - apart from d), everything is covered in more detail somewhere else. In my experience, it only causes confusion and/or gives lazy auditors somewhere to put NC's when they can't find the real clause.

Having said the above, I do like Note 2 - I think that helps organisations better understand why they can have a system which suits them.

 

[Antonio Vieira]

Will versions CD and DIS will be available free in the internet as they were in the 2k standard?

 

[David M McInerney]

What redundancy?

clause 7.4.1 states "The organization shall ensure that purchased product conforms to specified purchase requirements"

clause 7.4.3 states " The organization shall establish and implement the inspection or other activities necessary for ensuring that purchased product meets specified purchase requirements"

correct me if I am wrong but does this not say the same? One or the other but unnecessary to state both.
Dave