To sue, or not to sue: That is the question until you are the person bringing suit...

Wes Bucey

Quite Involved in Discussions
#31
Randy Stewart said:
I will start with: I know that this is a quality forum, not a legal infosite, etc. But, my feelings are that this is a a direct result of the big guy taking advatage of the little guy. Who else or what else can make a point like a lawsuit? I get burned with coffee and I bring a big guy to his knees. I don't agree with the lawsuit, but it is nationally known. Some one stood up to the international conglomeration know as McDonalds. Now we all pay for it!

But tell me, would any of you quality professionals want to inspect a doctors work???? Who is suppose to know what was a good operation and a substandard operation? Not me! I don't want to be the guy that has a sponge left in after a 16 hour operation, but on the same hand I can see 1 of 2000 being missed.
How do we pay for it? Mickey D hasn't raised the price of coffee at the one I regularly use for a bathroom run. Coffee and french fries are all I've bought from Mickey D in the past ten years and the prices seem to keep pace with Burger King in the next block. I do notice Starbuck's has the best quality cups to go along with its high price.

Re: doctors and quality
Actually, I'd relish the opportunity to restructure a lot of doctor's processes along with hospitals, pharmacies, nursing homes, and home health care outfits. Every time I visit one or the other, I see procedures which make me cringe.
  • Doctors hand out sample drugs without checking a patient's chart for history of adverse reaction to components in the newest reformulation of an old standby (reformulated just to keep ahead of the generics.)
  • Why check on the quality of a surgery? Many doctors and nurses don't wash their hands between patients. A recent study in Chicago showed over 10% of doctors, nurses, and aides neglected to wash hands between patients. Is it any wonder bacterial infection increases average hospital stay?
  • Hospitals and nursing homes still distribute drugs en masse in little paper or plastic cups lined up on a cart. Easy opportunity for mistakes, theft, switching, etc.
  • Pharmacies and/or doctors responsible for wrong dosage or even wrong drug due to misreading similar drug names on scrawled prescriptions.
  • Nursing homes which give sedatives to patients to keep them from wandering around, then compound the indignity by putting patients in diapers because they are too drugged to get up and go to the bathroom (also gets increased reimbursement under insurance and welfare "point" systems for extra "care" required to deal with diapers.)
  • Home health care workers who drop and injure patients because they are improperly trained in correct handling procedures.
None of these take special knowledge of medicine - just open eyes and common sense. Where is "mistake proofing" when it's needed?
 
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C

CINDY

#32
I too feel that the medical profession needs more quality standards. I have a huge scar on my leg due from infection because my doctor did not wash his hands or clean the skin area before cutting. I have also stopped going to doctors whom I have witnessed entering my room with gloves on and who knows how many patients he wore those same gloves with. I have also witnessed a doctor drop a dressing on the floor and pick it up only to apply it to a patients open wound.

Medical insurance is outrageous and one contributing factor is lawsuits. I feel that two thing contribute to this: 1) Doctors need to very mindful of their actions and follow procedure which includes washing their hands, confirming all instruments and supplies are accounted for after performing an operation etc. 2) Patients need to understand their risks and accept them, they have signed a waiver and if worse case happens and the doctor followed procedure, accept it, not sue for your suffering.

In summary, both sides of the coin has opportunities for improvement! :(

Cindy
 

gpainter

Quite Involved in Discussions
#33
I feel that the increase has been in part due to business having to do damage control and money issues, and the insurance companies and lawyers have a large responsibility to play in this. Many people know that business is an easy target to get a quick 10-20,000 dollars, just because of damage control and it is cheaper to pay upfront than it is to defend. I guess it all comes down to "a business decision".
 
C

CINDY

#34
You may be correct in that statement. When we owned our delivery service (B trucks) one winter my husband was part of a 23 car pile up from icy road conditions. The woman from the vehicle next to him sued us for a new vehicle even though our cars never touched and she came into the accident 5 minutes after our truck did. We wanted to fight it because the police report was accurate and stated the order of occurrances which left us clear of any responsibility in the damages she received to her vehicle. The police officer witnessed the whole thing. The insurance company would not consider fighting the claim, their comment was that it was easier just to pay. :mad:

The women saw a name on our truck and saw an opportunity and took full advantage. I hope she enjoys her new vehcile.

Cindy
 

Mike S.

Happy to be Alive
Trusted Information Resource
#35
CINDY said:
You may be correct in that statement. When we owned our delivery service (B trucks) one winter my husband was part of a 23 car pile up from icy road conditions. The woman from the vehicle next to him sued us for a new vehicle even though our cars never touched and she came into the accident 5 minutes after our truck did. We wanted to fight it because the police report was accurate and stated the order of occurrances which left us clear of any responsibility in the damages she received to her vehicle. The police officer witnessed the whole thing. The insurance company would not consider fighting the claim, their comment was that it was easier just to pay. :mad:

The women saw a name on our truck and saw an opportunity and took full advantage. I hope she enjoys her new vehcile.

Cindy
IMO the insurance company is then just enabling other criminals (that is what she is) like this woman to steal from them. Then they complain about it. :bonk: And bust on average people who were hit by their insured who are just trying to get their vehicle fixed fairly and correctly and get a rental while it is in the shop. (Side story) I once got nailed pretty bad in my truck by a guy on the interstate -- his fault and he was ticketed. It was right before deer season. I told his insurance company I wanted a rental truck, not the little Escort they were offering, because I need a truck and lost the use of a truck. They said no way. I said, well, expect the rental agency to bill you for clean-up of their car after I throw a dead deer in it and haul it back home over about 10 miles of rough dirt roads. They got me the truck. :frust:

I remember reading (in the Reader's Digest I believe) a few years ago of a sting run in NYC where a transit bus, mostly empty except for undercover police and insurance investigators and hidden cameras, faked an accident. If memory serves, over a dozen people jumped on the bus as it was stopped after the "accident" and began claiming neck and back "injuries". The worst part -- many of them were doctors or dentists.
 

SteelMaiden

Super Moderator
Super Moderator
#36
Mike S. said:
I remember reading (in the Reader's Digest I believe) a few years ago of a sting run in NYC where a transit bus, mostly empty except for undercover police and insurance investigators and hidden cameras, faked an accident. If memory serves, over a dozen people jumped on the bus as it was stopped after the "accident" and began claiming neck and back "injuries". The worst part -- many of them were doctors or dentists.
We (emergency medical services) see things like this one nearly every time we respond to a minor fender bender.
ex. call comes in for accident, car in ditch-minor or no damage, 4 patients, climbing out of car no apparant injuries, laughing and joking. When the ambulance tops the rise just before the intersection, 4 forms are seen dropping to the pavement in the middle of the road, where suddenly they are all in severe pain and near death's door. :confused:

ex. respond to motor vehicle accident, large male patient complains that his back must be broke, etc, etc. Now the guy's car is pretty high price, and there is very little damage to it...so you tell him that because the sports car is so hard to get him out of, you are going to cut the roof off to get him out. The gentleman promptly bounded out of the car saying that suddenly he feels much better, he must have just twisted something.:rolleyes:

ex. government building, customer slips on ice and "hurts their back". Witnesses state in trial that 1) plaintiff was overheard making plans for the scam, 2) witness at the govt. building saw the plaintiff walk around the parking lot to find a patch of ice, move their car, and then "fall" to ground with injury. :frust:

anyway, for what it's worth there are a few of my real life examples of lawsuits in the making.
 
G

Grizz1345

#37
After reading most of the posts it seems that most areas have been well covered. I would just like to narrow it down some. I believe that if lawyers, doctors and insurance companies started saying NO to the frivelous complaints and illegal claims things might change. As long as it is "business as usual" nothing will change except the costs which will continue to rise. I learned as a young boy that there is a price for all of my actions. Sometimes I did not like my father's choice but I sure learned what was worth doing and then again what was painful. In my later years I try to stay away from the painful things and laugh at my own mistakes. Hopefully the mistakes I make today are alot less serious than my earlier years.

Don't expect me to pay your way for being clumsy or inattentive to life, I cost myself enough.

Have a great weekend. :ko:
 
E

energy

#38
An Oldie?

I think this has been kicking around awhile, may even be in the humor thread, but I believe there is a measure of truth to them.

Stella Awards

It's time once again to consider the candidates for the annual Stella Awards. The Stella's are named after 81-year-old Stella Liebeck who spilled coffee on herself and successfully sued McDonalds. That case inspired the Stella Awards for the most frivolous successful lawsuits in the United States.

The following are this year's candidates:



1. Kara Walton of Claymont, Delaware, successfully sued the owner of a nightclub in a neighboring city when she fell from the bathroom window to the floor and knocked out her two front teeth. This occurred while Ms. Walton was trying to sneak through the window in the ladies room to avoid paying the $3.50 cover charge. She was awarded $12,000 and dental expenses.

2. Jerry Williams of Little Rock, Arkansas, was awarded $14,500 and medical expenses after being bitten on the buttocks by his next-door neighbor's beagle. The beagle was on a chain in its owner's fenced yard. The award was less than sought because the jury felt the dog might have been just a little provoked at the time by Mr. Williams who was shooting it repeatedly with a pellet gun.

3. A 19-year-old Carl Truman of Los Angeles won $74,000 and medical expenses when his neighbor ran over his hand with a Honda Accord. Mr. Truman apparently didn't notice there was someone at the wheel of the car when he was trying to steal his neighbor's hub caps.

4. A. Philadelphia restaurant was ordered to pay Amber Carson of Lancaster, Pennsylvania, $113,500 a! after she slipped on a soft drink spill and broke her coccyx (tailbone). The beverage was on the floor because Ms. Carson had thrown it at her boyfriend 30 seconds earlier during an argument.

5. Terrence Dickson of Bristol, Pennsylvania, was leaving a house he had just finished robbing by way of the garage. He was not able to get the garage door to go up since the automatic door opener was malfunctioning. He couldn't reenter the house because the door connecting the house and garage locked when he pulled it shut. The family was on vacation, and Mr. Dickson found himself locked in the garage for eight days. He subsisted on a case of Pepsi he found and a large bag of dry dog food. He sued the homeowner's insurance claiming the situation caused him undue mental anguish. The jury agreed to the tune of $500,000.

6. A jury of her peers awarded Kathleen Robertson of Austin, Texas, $780,000 after breaking her ankle by tripping over a toddler who was running inside a furniture store. The owners of the store were understandably surprised at the verdict, considering the misbehaving little toddler was Ms. Robertson's son.

7. This year's favorite could easily be Mr. Merv Grazinski of Oklahoma City, Oklahoma. Mr. Grazinski purchased a brand new 32-foot Winnebago motor home. On his first trip home, having driven onto the freeway, he set the cruise control at 70 mph and calmly left the drivers seat to go into the back and make himself a cup of coffee. Not surprisingly, the R.V. left the freeway, crashed and overturned. Mr. Grazinski sued Winnebago for not advising him in the owner's manual that he couldn't actually do this. The jury awarded him $1,750,000 plus a new motor home. The company actually changed their manuals on the basis of this suit, just in case there were any other complete morons buying their recreation vehicles.

;)
 

Peter Fraser

Trusted Information Resource
#39
energy said:
I think this has been kicking around awhile, may even be in the humor thread, but I believe there is a measure of truth to them.

Stella Awards
Energy, can I withdraw my comment that Scots don't have a go at the Yanks? This is exactly what prompted my original comments - I cannot believe that anyone (jury / judge / man in the street / anyone with any common sense at all) could come to decisions like these. It doesn't happen in the UK - yet! Can anyone figure out why it happens anywhere?

There doesn't seem to be any reason to it at all. What also concerns me is that Wallace is (quite justifiably) promoting Deming's system of Profound Knowledge in another thread. Deming stated that people go to work wanting to do a good job, and that it is "the system" that stops them - what is "the system" that makes jurors / judges come up with such decisions?

Are we at risk of having intellectual discussions about the theory, when the reality is so far removed that they will never connect? For self protection (of the Scots), what can we do to avoid this happening to us?
 
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