Toyota & ISO 9001 - Toyota Production System (TPS)

Marc

Hunkered Down for the Duration
Staff member
Admin
#1
Anyone hear anything about this?

From: "David M. Jenkins"
Newsgroups: misc.industry.quality
Subject: Toyota & ISO 9000
Date: Sun, 08 Oct 2000 16:51:48 GMT

Friend of mine in the UK forwarded this Japanese news item to me.

"The following was reported in Nikkei Business. Nikkei Business is published weekly and one of the most popular business journals in Japan.

In October of 1999 it featured a three-week series about ISO 9000 problems in Japan. In the articles it said that Toyota decided not to get ISO9000 because it saw no value in terms of quality and thus saw no need to register.

The decision had been made after the Shimoyama factory, which is an engine plant, had registered to ISO9001. When introducing new things, Toyota's philosophy is to test actually before installation rather than discuss on the desk. The Shimoyama factory had been selected as a test plant.

And after the test, Toyota concluded there was no value in ISO9000 registration."

Interesting that Toyota - a company much admired for its approach to quality - should reject ISO 9001 registration. I haven't seen the original article: does anyone out there know if it is ISO 9001 that Toyota rejected or ISO 9001 registration?

David M. Jenkins
Vancouver, BC
 
Elsmar Forum Sponsor
R

rrramirez

#2
Toyota Japan rejects ISO 9000

My thanks to Takaji Nishizawa, a leading industrial consultant in Japan,
for this item:

>>
The following was reported in Nikkei Business. Nikkei Business is published
weekly and one of the most popular business journals in Japan.

In October of 1999 it featured a three-week series about ISO 9000 problems in
Japan. In the articles it said that Toyota decided not to get ISO9000
because it saw no value in terms of quality and thus saw no need to register.

The decision had been made after the Shimoyama factory, which is an engine
plant, had registered to ISO9001. When introducing new things, Toyota's
philosophy is to test actually before installation rather than discuss on
the desk. The Shimoyama factory had been selected as a test plant.

And after the test, Toyota concluded there was no value in ISO9000
registration.

<<

No surprise there! Our advice remains the same: do not register to ISO
9000.
Takaji Nishizawa also tells me that the ISO 9000 assessors are charging
high fees in Japan - reflecting the seller's market. Why do Japanese
companies register? Same as for all other countries: market-place coercion.

Vanguard News October 2000
 
R

Roger Eastin

#3
Each to his own... I think for companies with "mature" quality systems, registration is not essential. It should form a base for quality systems thinking within an organization. Particularly, for small companies, ISO9000 can be a good first step for this systems thinking and I think registration is a tool to hold the organization's feet to the fire. You may not need it forever, but it helps to begin with it.
 
A

Andy Bassett

#4
I agree wholeheartedly with Roger. IMHO it is not correct to promote ISO as a tool suitable for all business's in all environments, neither is it correct to write ISo off as bureacratic waste of time, as Vangaurd persistently do.

It is a tool that can be most successfully used in a environment that has a manufacturing bias, that maybe has a discipline/cohesion problem, and that is taking ISO 9000 as a first step on the quality road. It can be bent of course to all other situations, but i beleive you sacrifice some results during the 'bending'.

Regards



------------------
Andy B
 
A

Alchemists

#5
The decision to pursue ISO9000 in the absence of a mandate to do so is an important one. Automobile manufacturers do not fall into the category of "required to register". The engine plant at Toyota looked carefully at the value produced by pursuit of / registration to ISO9000 and found it added little value 'for them'. Toyota as a whole has a mature, robust approach to Quality Management - one which includes the requirements of ISO9001:94 and the recommendations of ISO9004:94.
Since pursuit of registration would not likely improve their competitive position, nor would it enhance either bottom or top line performance, their choice was entirely appropriate.
Mindless pursuit of anything is a waste of resources. Toyota did their homework - including an aggressive pilot, and made a choice.
We should all be as smart.....

Jeffrey Edwards
 

Sidney Vianna

Post Responsibly
Staff member
Admin
#7
Moving forward.

Marc said:
Contemporary comments?
There is no DRIVER (pun not intended) for Toyota to "implement" ISO 9001, but, as mentioned a couple of times, this should NOT be misconstrued as Toyota being adverse to ISO Management Systems Standards, since all of their North American operations, INCLUDING manufacturing plants, parts & distribution centers, warehouses and other sites have implemented and attained certification to ISO 14001. Some have also adopted and attained certification to OHSAS 18001.
 

Helmut Jilling

Auditor / Consultant
#8
Sidney Vianna said:
There is no DRIVER (pun not intended) for Toyota to "implement" ISO 9001, but, as mentioned a couple of times, this should NOT be misconstrued as Toyota being adverse to ISO Management Systems Standards, since all of their North American operations, INCLUDING manufacturing plants, parts & distribution centers, warehouses and other sites have implemented and attained certification to ISO 14001. Some have also adopted and attained certification to OHSAS 18001.

I have been in many plants - World Class, good ones, average ones, and even pretty poor ones. It is kind of interesting, but it generally is not the world-class ones who argue they don't need ISO, TS, or whatever.

Maybe they could have achieved world class without it, but they generally recognize the value from a disciplined approach to quality management. I have heard large tier 1's argue against it, but generally not the few world-class ones I've seen.

Toyota indeed has the same general principles at work in a disciplined fashion in their systems. It is not in a casual, ad-hoc manner.
 
B

Baldrick

#9
I see no conflict...

Does anyone doubt that Toyota are not compliant with ISO9001:2000? Can anyone identify something in the standard that Toyota DON'T do? Is there any of the 8 fundamental principles of ISO9000 that Toyota DON'T agree with? I doubt it, but I'd be happy to hear someone tell me I'm wrong.

Toyota aren't saying "ISO9000 is wrong". They're just saying "We've already got a system that does all that and more so there's no need".

I see nothing wrong with that?
 

Marc

Hunkered Down for the Duration
Staff member
Admin
#10
Yes - I think that is the default conclusion. I don't think anyone is saying there is something 'wrong' with what Toyota is doing.

Remember, this thread was started in 2000. I was mostly wondering if anything has changed.
 
Thread starter Similar threads Forum Replies Date
K TS 16949 (Ford, DCX, Toyota) Audit of an ISO 17025 (GM Only) In-House Laboratory ISO 17025 related Discussions 2
A Has Toyota Approved ISO / TS 16949? IATF 16949 - Automotive Quality Systems Standard 2
B Does Toyota utilize IATF 16949? IATF 16949 - Automotive Quality Systems Standard 4
L Toyota doesn’t use Six Sigma Six Sigma 1
C A couple CSR (Customer Specific Requirements) questions... Esp. Ford & Toyota Customer and Company Specific Requirements 5
D TS16949 Annex A versus Toyota MQC's IATF 16949 - Automotive Quality Systems Standard 14
Stijloor Toyota recalls more than 6 million vehicles. World News 5
S Toyota PPAP Information Misc. Quality Assurance and Business Systems Related Topics 3
L Christmas Toyota Accelerator Problem Settlement for the New Year! World News 9
P What is the last revision of Toyota SQAM (Supplier Quality Assurance Manual)? Customer and Company Specific Requirements 3
R Does anyone have the list of Toyota PPAP requirements? APQP and PPAP 6
B Toyota FMDS (Floor Management Developmental System) Manufacturing and Related Processes 5
J New Toyota Supplier Quality Manual is on the Toyota Web Site Customer and Company Specific Requirements 1
L Rise and fall of Toyota - sourcing information for a presentation IATF 16949 - Automotive Quality Systems Standard 7
F Toyota A3 Practical Problem Solving (PPS) Document Needed Nonconformance and Corrective Action 1
Stijloor Toyota to extend development time to ensure quality World News 0
Stijloor Toyota drags down new-vehicle quality average World News 9
Stijloor Toyota Supplier Quality Assurance Manual (SQAM) is revised - April 2010 Customer and Company Specific Requirements 4
Marc Criminal probe launched into Toyota's safety problems World News 25
Marc What are Toyota's idled U.S. workers doing? World News 4
L Toyota Recall - What caused the issue with the accelerator? Quality Tools, Improvement and Analysis 53
Marc Toyota Halts U.S. Sales of 8 Recalled Models World News 16
A Toyota will recall 3.8 million vehicles in the United States World News 0
Stijloor Toyota SQAM Issue 4K, August, 2009 Now Available. Supplier Quality Assurance and other Supplier Issues 2
1 TS16949 vs. TPS (Toyota Production System) - Explaining the differences IATF 16949 - Automotive Quality Systems Standard 12
J Toyota's quality planning and quality management system documents Document Control Systems, Procedures, Forms and Templates 5
bobdoering Survey:Toyota loses luster with suppliers-Ford has made strides in supplier relations World News 7
Stijloor How Toyota fell so spectacularly World News 0
Marc Toyota Cuts Production Goal to 7-Year Low World News 1
bobdoering Toyota forecasts $8.6B loss, says 1 million sales will vanish World News 2
A Toyota may ask for $2 billion in loans World News 0
A Toyota cost-cutting program World News 1
bobdoering Toyota Expects Losses To Triple World News 6
A Toyota to Recall More Than 1.35 Million Cars World News 0
Marc Car Slump Jolts Toyota, Halting 70 Years of Gain World News 3
bobdoering Isuzu, Toyota Put Clean Diesel Engine Project On Hold. World News 1
bobdoering Toyota halts U.S. Prius project World News 0
Stijloor Stung Toyota cuts production deeper in N.A. World News 17
Q Searching for TOYOTA product development system (Toyota Production System) Customer and Company Specific Requirements 9
Sidney Vianna Toyota's winglet - leaner version of the Segway Coffee Break and Water Cooler Discussions 0
B Toyota supplier portal? Customer and Company Specific Requirements 3
D Production Process in Ceramics - Toyota Production System Process Maps, Process Mapping and Turtle Diagrams 3
Stijloor Toyota eyes new batteries, engines. World News 2
Stijloor Toyota ousts Ford as No. 2 US automaker World News 3
M Toyota Supplier "Pulse Rate" Evaluation - Is this document part of the Toyota SQAM? Customer and Company Specific Requirements 4
A Toyota Weld Specification TSH5603G needed Customer and Company Specific Requirements 6
N Why has Toyota won Market Share from General Motors? Misc. Quality Assurance and Business Systems Related Topics 12
Stijloor Toyota is Slipping, Consumer Reports Says Coffee Break and Water Cooler Discussions 12
Q Problem Analysis / Problem Solving - Toyota A3 Method Forms Nonconformance and Corrective Action 1
W Labor Woes at Toyota Outlined World News 27

Similar threads

Top Bottom