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TS16949:2002 checklist - MS Word .doc Document attached

A

axleman1 - 2011

#21
Does anyone have any other helpful tools that they can share regarding auditing an internal TS16949:2002 QMS?
 
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D

dar07

#22
Re: TS16949:2002 checklist - MS Word Document attached

Hi SilverHawk, great info thanks - I'm new at auditing - is there no checklist to speak of that I can use for internal auditing? I have to use something for the auditors.
 
#23
Dar07:

Internal auditors should be coached to develop their own checklists. It's a bit like going to the store to shop for food. Each time you go, you need something different although there are some 'staples' which you get nearly every time.

So, as for each shopping trip, an internal auditor should study the audit assigment they are given (that's the 'scope' and 'criteria' of the audit) and prepare. Otherwise, they will, in effect, be going to the store with the same list each time and bringing back the same stuff. Boring!

Don't be tempted to use canned checklists, like the one at the start of this thread. You have to use a process apprach to auditing TS (and ISO 9001) and that first checklist doesn't do that for you. Also, there are a number of other issues relating to simply following a preplanned checklist.

Believe me - I've been doing this type of thing for over 20 years. Checklists can be the "road to ruin of a well intentioned audit program.
 
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D

dar07

#24
Andy,
thank you so much - this really helps me a lot. I've been so frustrated with no help and this is my first audit for TS. I may have some more questions once I get started if you don't mind? I really need a professional's help on this and you have given me the best info so far.

Thanks again!
 
#25
Andy,
thank you so much - this really helps me a lot. I've been so frustrated with no help and this is my first audit for TS. I may have some more questions once I get started if you don't mind? I really need a professional's help on this and you have given me the best info so far.

Thanks again!
Happy to help! Let me know if there are any specifics, either here or by pm.
 

Patricia Ravanello

Quite Involved in Discussions
#26
Andy,
thank you so much - this really helps me a lot. I've been so frustrated with no help and this is my first audit for TS. I may have some more questions once I get started if you don't mind? I really need a professional's help on this and you have given me the best info so far.

Thanks again!
Andy is definitely leading you in the right direction. The guidelines for auditing have changed since this thread began and Check Lists are now frowned upon, because they don't comply with the Process Approach.

The way an audit should start is by the Internal Auditor reviewing the Performance Metrics of the process which they are auditing. Ask the process owners "how they measure the effectiveness and efficiency of the process", or "how they know that their process is effective and efficient". The status of the metrics will help direct them to where they need to do a deep dive in the audit. A review of process performance and any resulting corrective actions that were taken can help lead the auditor to the problem areas, and might help uncover the potential root cause of poor performance.

Along with that, in preparation for the audit, if need be, the internal auditors should use the "Flow Charts" of your processes, and prepare appropriate questions for the audit following the documented flow...that's what the "process approach" is all about. Don't focus on the "standard elements".

You shouldn't have to be concerned about auditing every "element" of the standards, because your system documents already address each "element", as confirmed at your initial Document Audit, performed by the External Auditor. Good Luck!

Patricia.
 

Helmut Jilling

Auditor / Consultant
#27
Does anyone have any other helpful tools that they can share regarding auditing an internal TS16949:2002 QMS?

I am putting on a couple public trainings for internal auditing if any of you are interested.

One is for ISO 9001 in Pittsburgh on Sept. 17-19.

The other is for TS-16949 in Cleveland, OH on Oct. 16-18. (I am an IATF credentialed TS 3rd party auditor).

If anyone is interested in either, let me know. We have a few seats left in either class. The class is built around the concept of developing your own checksheets, as Andy mentioned in his posts. We will also share a framework we developed to help participants develop their own audit documents.

And, of course, both sessions are completely based on the process approach to internal auditing - metrics and all.

Best wishes on your first audit...
 

Helmut Jilling

Auditor / Consultant
#29
Not sure if you already have a copy, but just in case.....
(It has been retyped completely.....so excuse any spelling errors if you find them)

Please note, this checksheet was offered in 2002. That checklist today can only be used as a gap analysis, which it does well. It cannot be used as the basis for an internal or external audits. Those audits must be performed to a process approach, not a clause based approach. (ref. TS Rules, ver 2, annex 5). That would be an automatic nonconformance.

The TS Rules, ver 2, Annex 5: clearly does not allow internal audits. Annex 5 reads in part:

  • IATF expects ISO/TS 16949:2002 auditors to audit based upon the customer oriented processes defined by the organization.​
  • The Automotive Process Approach to auditing for ISO/TS 16949:2002 must not be driven by a “clause” or a “section” driven checklist.​

  • [*]
    Any ISO/TS 16949:2002 auditor therefore must be capable of understanding the IATF Automotive Process Approach as well as the process approach and process map of the audited entity.​
The whole annex 5 should be read. It is very insightful. The checklist posted can only serve as a gap analysis.
 
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