What are National Equivalences for Guide 25 & ISO/IEC 17025? Clause 4.11.2.b.1

[J Kay]

In 4.11.2.b.1 it refers to "national equivalent", what are national equivalences for Guide 25 & ISO/IEC 17025?

Recently our in-house lab went through a ISO/IEC 17025 audit by A2LA and received a nonconformity for not using accredited calibration services. It was recommended that we request a wavier from A2LA refer the use of these services. My question is. Will QS-9000 Registrars do the same, allow us to use these non-accredited services with a wavier from them.

I am trying to advise our management as to what we should do with this requirement.

Thanks !!!!

 

[Al Dyer]

J Kay,

Just one question:

Why in god's name would you not want to use an accredited lab?

 

[Marc]

> It was recommended that we request a wavier from A2LA
> refer the use of these services.

I'm not sure what you mean by "...refer the use of these services..."

> My question is. Will
> QS-9000 Registrars do the same, allow us to use these
> non-accredited services with a wavier from them.

As I understand it, you have no choice but to use accredited calibration service providers. Just because the A2LA may give you a waiver, I don't believe there is any agreement between the QS folks and the A2LA folks on not having to use accredited calibration services provider if the A2LA decides that a waiver is OK.

What it is that you are having calibrated by 'non-accredited' calibration service providers?

I would like this confirmed by some current QS auditors, but this is the way I understand it.

> In <4.11.2.b.1> it refers to "national equivalent", what
> are national equivalences for Guide 25 & ISO/IEC 17025?

This refers to other countries where they might not 'agree' with 17025 but have an equivalent 'national' standard. So - if you live in (well, let's say Samolia) and they don't recognize 17025 but they do have an equivalent Samolian national standard - their equivalent standard shall apply. So - the 'national equivalent' depends upon what country you live in.

 

[D.Scott]

J Kay - The waiver referred to by A2LA is definately not acceptable for purposes of QS-9000. We were granted waivers by A2LA when we were first accredited but that was before the QS-9000 expiration date they set at 1/1/01. Even though the waiver granted by A2LA had not expired, they were no good for QS purposes after that date.

QS-9000 auditors are currently very big on the accredited lab thing and you WILL get a nonconformance if they find it.

They are finding a lot for scales. vision systems, salt spray units etc. One of the hang-ups is that the OEM "allowance" is only ok if there is no other accredited source.

The mom and pop shops are getting hurt on this one as they are usually the ones who aren't accredited. The AIAG has set up a registry of approved calibration sources which specifically helps these services. It is low cost (about $400 per year for registration + the cost of the compliance audit). If some of your shops fall into this group, have them contact the AIAG and look at the 2pCP program. It is also linked on the AIAG web site.

If you need more info on this, let me know - I am one of the approved 2pCP auditors (but I don't do it as my job LOL).

Dave

 

[J Kay]

Marc,

A little typo "refer" should have been "reference"

To all,

Thanks for the input. This will help me carry my point across to all here.

Thanks !!!

 

[JerryStem]

We are an accredited lab (Guide 25) for calibrations (coating/plating thickness measurement). I called one of my customers today, reminding them they had many standards due for recertifying this month.

They told me they have a different unit (same type, different maker) and they are sending the standards to the OEM. When I asked if they were QS9K (yes) and were they aware that they needed an accredited lab, since one was available, they said "Oh no, we're just using the OEM"....

Is it that the assessors don't know how/where to look for accredited labs? I thought even A2LA added key word searching to their site, they could easily find us there...

Am I on the right track?

Jerry
UPA Technology