What to do when Auditee refuses to sign Audit Report

D

ddchhaya

#11
We are dealing with evidence based management system. One of the eight management principles in ISO 9000:2005 is fact based approach.

The three things needed for reporting nonconformity are:
1 Requirement
2 Finding and if the finding is that of a failure, then
3 Evidence

Once the audit finding includes these three essential features of reporting there is no need for obtaining signature as whatever is documented in the report is evidence based and verifiable.

Moreover, the organizational leadership (again one of the eight management principles) need to stress to auditees that there is a goal congruence between auditors and the auditees. Both aim at system checking and identifying opportunities for improvement to cause continual improvement. Once audit is perceived as value adding activity and not for personal appraisal or finding faults, there will be a culture of trust and no need for signatures.
 
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somashekar

Staff member
Super Moderator
#12
Hi, can anyone advise on what to do when the auditee refuse to sign the audit report?

She refuse to sign because she is only one month in the job and she claims that she has no training... She is resigning soon and no other person is incharge for the area except her, hr is still looking for her replacement..our audit is due soon and we need the iqa documents completed..

She is reporting directly to the CEO and insists that CEO should sign not her..but during the time of audit, the CEO is not around..
Is she not right in a way ... ?
She is in fact even giving you the correct reference to whom the audit report has to be taken and explained.
Can you tell me that all others who sign the report are doing a perfect job in addressing any findings in the audit report ?
The spirit here is to find processes where things are good and where things can be improved and where things need to be corrected. Can this be achieved collectively ~~~
 

John Broomfield

Staff member
Super Moderator
#13
Hi, can anyone advise on what to do when the auditee refuse to sign the audit report?

She refuse to sign because she is only one month in the job and she claims that she has no training... She is resigning soon and no other person is incharge for the area except her, hr is still looking for her replacement..our audit is due soon and we need the iqa documents completed..

She is reporting directly to the CEO and insists that CEO should sign not her..but during the time of audit, the CEO is not around..
miwriter,

The auditee's representative lacks the authority to accept the audit report on behalf of the organization.

So, seek a closing meeting with someone who has the authority (senior person on site).

This may be a long closing meeting because you did not plan the audit with someone in authority.

...last resort, email the report to the CEO.

She has done you a favor by reminding you she did not have the authority to accept the report (you should have ascertained this when you were planning the audit).

John
 

Wes Bucey

Quite Involved in Discussions
#14
FWIW: In my opinion, the signature request/requirement is "mission creep" on the part of the person or committee which imposed the requirement. There is no International Standard which imposes such requirement, so it is either an internal requirement or a misinterpretation of an internal requirement.

As we so often write here in the Cove:
SHOW ME THE SHALL!

[FONT=Verdana, sans-serif]If there is such a written requirement, it probably should be re-evaluated for purpose and effectiveness. What is gained for the organization with the signature?[/FONT]
 
D

ddchhaya

#15
I do agree with Mr Somashekar that perfection is a myth. Perfection means no scope for improvement. That is the reason why the standards call for continuous improvement. I could not understand the context of "can it be achieved collectively ~~~". If that comment is on the collective effort of auditor and auditee, I agree that auditor's role is confined to unearthing hidden defects in the system and reporting the same (along with noteworthy findings and potential problem areas). Acting upon findings (failures) is the responsibility of the auditee's team. The person who signs and accepts the report alone is neither singularly responsible for the situation that created NC nor singularly responsible to close the NC. He/she has to involve people (Again ref eight management principles) in order to find the root cause and prepare/implement corrective action plan.

Here the question is that of accountability. If responsibility of facing/ facilitating audit is delegated to a person, and even that person signs acceptance based on verifying the requirement with the reference document/record quoted, verifying that genuinely there was a failure and the failure has been evidenced by way of documents, records, personal interviews and observation of activities in progress, accountability would still remain with the head of the section/department/site being audited.

I also agree with Mr Wes Bucey that there is a need to revisit internal procedures that necessitate auditee to sign the audit report. I really do not see the need in a mature organization that the principal auditee or his/her representative has to sign the acceptance of the report.

In the subject case, I agree that the report needs to be e:mailed to the process owner. E:mailed documents do not need signatures!
 

Wes Bucey

Quite Involved in Discussions
#17
Pack it up, go home and put dinner on your expense report.
Yep. That's pretty much what most of us WISH we could do when caught with a meaningless task or requirement imposed by someone with the power to impose it. It might be more palatable if the "powers that be" had been through Deming's Red Beads training and could articulate (as part of the training for this poor internal auditor) what the purpose of the signature requirement is, and, further, that it had been evaluated and found to be valuable to the organization. Armed with that information, he could pass that on to the targeted signatory, whom, I'm sure, was just :ca::ca::ca: - tsk, tsk!

By the way,
I'm pretty sure most internal auditors do NOT get an expense account for lunch or dinner or drinks or even carfare, since they usually audit the location where they report to work every day. I'm pretty sure IRS would frown on that as being a legitimate expense.:mg:

P.S. RANDY:
You forgot to put in the smiley face to take the sting out of a humorous comment.:eek::eek::notme:
 
C

ChrissieO

#19
I can't see what the issue is here. In the 14 years I have been auditing, we have never required a signature from an auditee - just change your auditing SOP.

I think your main problem is in your audit planning.

Plan an audit that means something so that senior management see the value in it, then plan the close out so that the persons with the authority are present to agree NCs, RnRs and time lines. They will attend or send a deputy if they see the value in the audit.

Chrissie
 

Stijloor

Staff member
Super Moderator
#20
Hi, can anyone advise on what to do when the auditee refuse to sign the audit report?

She refuse to sign because she is only one month in the job and she claims that she has no training... She is resigning soon and no other person is incharge for the area except her, hr is still looking for her replacement..our audit is due soon and we need the iqa documents completed..

She is reporting directly to the CEO and insists that CEO should sign not her..but during the time of audit, the CEO is not around..
This scenario is another example of an organization emulating external (Certification body/Registrar) audit practices. The minor-major nonconformity classification and the 30 or 45-day limit on corrective action close-outs are examples of what one sees in internal audit procedures. As a result, internal audits are viewed as punitive and employees will resist.

An organization only has to follow 8.2.2 and what else makes sense for an effective internal audit process that contributes to continual improvement and mitigating risks.

Stijloor.
 
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