SBS - The best value in QMS software

Where to begin defining and monitoring Quality Metrics in a Machine Shop

N

novusqc

#1
I have been tasked to develope metrics to monitor processes from the machine shop scrap/rework rate as well as the assembly scrap/rework rate. This is quite new to me and could use a helping hand in how to develope these metrics metrics on a basic excell spread sheet that I can graph weelky.

PLEASE HELP!!!
 
Elsmar Forum Sponsor

Wes Bucey

Prophet of Profit
#2
I have been tasked to develope metrics to monitor processes from the machine shop scrap/rework rate as well as the assembly scrap/rework rate. This is quite new to me and could use a helping hand in how to develope these metrics metrics on a basic excell spread sheet that I can graph weelky.

PLEASE HELP!!!
First, a simple question:
What occasioned the request for metrics?

Then some possible follow up questions:

  1. Are the scrap bins full?
  2. Do operators seem to be spending more time in rework and repair than in original production?
  3. Have profits begun to slide?
  4. Do the bosses know the true costs of producing products? (I had a contract machining company as a consulting client that charged a straight $100/hour for machine time, but never bothered to check if the calculated rate of production (feeds and speeds calculations) came close to be matched by actual production rates.
  5. Are there a wide variety of products (general job shop) or high production of just a few products?
  6. Is there any sort of SPC charting being performed?
  7. Are products inspected by operators or by separate inspectors?
  8. What's the lag time between production and inspection?
  9. How many faulty parts are made AFTER the first nonconforming part?
I ran my own high precision contract machining company for ten years. I've written about our efficiencies a number of times, most recently, I wrote
I not only preached this; I practiced it! See
http://elsmar.com/Forums/showpost.ph...9&postcount=18
and
http://elsmar.com/Forums/showpost.ph...6&postcount=20

especially in post 18, where I write, emphasis added Quote:
We had no quality inspectors (we did have quality trainers and guys who acted as "court of last resort" when a question would arise.) Operators did own first article inspections, based on control plan/inspection plan agreed with customer as part of contract review. Another operator would perform a redundant first article inspection with different inspection instruments. Marked sample with BOTH inspection reports was sent to customer for confirmation before production began.

In-process inspection, SPC, etc. was performed by operator in real time. If nonconformance was discovered, production would halt - all operators would collaborate on finding and curing cause, only calling in outside help if solution eluded them. Inspection records, charts, etc. went right to computer where they were available in real time to in-house folk and customers.

Operators had autonomy to bring in experts from our suppliers of material, capital equipment, and expendable tooling to stay up to date on industry innovation. Sometimes, we shut the whole shop down and chartered a bus to take us to the International Machine Tool Show to spend the day.

If an operator wanted to see a customer's operation and how his product was used, we made it happen. Similarly for a supplier's operation.

As almost any consultant will agree, the crux of streamlining an organization's operation lies in the mental attitude of the top leaders. Despite what some soothsayers may say or write, it is extremely rare for the tail to wag the dog, meaning staff members do not initiate projects with any hope of success unless the top management makes a real commitment to support the initiative (this means tangible ACTION, not "lip service.")

In other posts, I have discussed the evolution of automated inspection and data entry, beginning with hard wiring inspection instruments directly into computer networks and using bar code scanners throughout the production to track the status of an order, progressing up to WIFI and RFID. Each change to the process requires FMEA (Failure Mode & Effects Analysis), economic analysis and ROI. Certainly, using mistake proofing tools like inspection jigs and specialized instruments is a good step in the right direction for increasing the efficiency and effectiveness of the ENTIRE production cycle, from handling quotations and procuring raw materials up through and including packaging, shipping, and collecting payment. __________________
 

harry

Super Moderator
#3
I have been tasked to develope metrics to monitor processes from the machine shop scrap/rework rate as well as the assembly scrap/rework rate. This is quite new to me and could use a helping hand in how to develope these metrics metrics on a basic excell spread sheet that I can graph weelky.

PLEASE HELP!!!
From the contents of your post, it appears you want to know how to calculate machine shop scrap/rework rate and assembly scrap/rework rate rather than what was indicated in the title of your post. Is that right?

Scrap
 
Last edited:

Wes Bucey

Prophet of Profit
#4
One shot wonders

:confused:
Over the last eight years [approximately], it seems like I have tried to give a reasoned response to many first-time posters who ask legitimate questions, only to learn the Original Poster has never logged back in weeks, months, or years later.

If the OP has checked email notification, then he probably has read the first response, but not ensuing ones.

Posters, of course, do not HAVE to log in to read the responses, but often ensuing posts ask questions for clarification and we wait with bated breath for the clarification which never comes.

I want to make it clear I am not angry, but I am sad that somehow we "failed" a one hit wonder with a legitimate question and I find myself wondering
  1. if our email notice got caught in a spam folder and the OP is unaware there is a response
  2. if somehow the OP lost access to his email (job change?)
  3. if he forgot his password and can't be bothered to correspond with Marc for help
  4. if the OP was insulted or confused by the response and decided to break from the Cove
  5. if the sheer size of the Cove is just too intimidating for some folks

Now the original poster to this thread has not returned to comment on Harry's question in almost a month. Is this "just the way forums work" or is there something additional we can do in the way of emailing these folks to bring them back.

(I do recall a discussion among Moderators a few years back where it was suggested some, not all, one hit wonders had created "anonymous" email addresses to join the Cove and simply forgot the password to re-access those accounts.)

Do I have a legitimate concern or am I just an old man musing on a wintry afternoon?
 

optomist1

A Sea of Statistics
Super Moderator
#5
Wow Wes,

excellent post/info and timely for me. Hope to read it in the next couple days....hope you don't mind if I pose a few questions.....a while ago another cover posted about "non-normal data distribution regarding precision machining.....let me rephrase that....a rectangular or uniform distribution as a better method or fit rather than attempting to do one of the various transformations. Did you have any experience in this area?

Thanks again....
Marty
 

Wes Bucey

Prophet of Profit
#6
Wow Wes,

excellent post/info and timely for me. Hope to read it in the next couple days....hope you don't mind if I pose a few questions.....a while ago another cover posted about "non-normal data distribution regarding precision machining.....let me rephrase that....a rectangular or uniform distribution as a better method or fit rather than attempting to do one of the various transformations. Did you have any experience in this area?

Thanks again....
Marty
I'm not certain what you are trying to achieve here. In simple terms, modern CNC machinery can hold such tight tolerances, we are more likely to experience "one-way" variation because of the tool wear than any other variation. Depending on the run length, most precision shops plan for this wear. The type of statistical reporting used is not dictated and depends more on the comfort level of the guy creating the reporting method. Covers like Bob Doering and Steve Prevette are much more familiar than I with the day-to-day reporting and may weigh in later with a learned discourse :notme: on the topic.
 

optomist1

A Sea of Statistics
Super Moderator
#7
Hi Wes,

Thank you for your response...I read some of Bob's postings, and I find the whole matter of "normal" vs "non-normal" processes/data interesting....present company excluded, it seems that when presented data that does not fit the bell shaped curve, many are at a loss. Some prefer to perform a transform in lieu of locating the suitable distribution....taking the shortest route. Thank you again for your insight.

Marty
 

bobdoering

Stop X-bar/R Madness!!
Trusted Information Resource
#8
Hi Wes,

Thank you for your response...I read some of Bob's postings, and I find the whole matter of "normal" vs "non-normal" processes/data interesting....present company excluded, it seems that when presented data that does not fit the bell shaped curve, many are at a loss. Some prefer to perform a transform in lieu of locating the suitable distribution....taking the shortest route. Thank you again for your insight.

Marty
Yes, to gain control of a precision machining process, charting with the X hi/lo -R will gain you the insight you need for timely adjustments and tool changes for CNC. No need for transformations. It is not normal, but the math for a rectangle is pretty straight forward...:tg: Porper charting, with gages of adequate resolution (ndc>10) should put you in a position to drastically reduce scrap. For any dimension not charted, always run to about 75% of the print tolerance in the shop. That also cuts rejections. The shop floor does not own the entire tolerance!
 
W

widetrack

#9
Re: One shot wonders

Mr Bucey,
I am new to this forum, and as such I tend to be reserved about getting involved. But in other forums I have engaged in I have taken the time to track down a couple of people who were "one hit wonders" such as this. What I found at that time were two people who found themselves tasked with trying to learn something in a short period of time and so reacted by frantically searching for a path that made them feel more comfortable. Having found such a path, they never went back to close all the doors they had opened. Not so much as a lack of appreciation, but rather being engrossed in their task, and all else falling by the wayside. (possibly, at one time one of those people was me). I don't believe this to be a failure on the part of anyone here, but rather one of the byproducts of the world we now live in. this forum and the people on it give an opportunity to people around the world, I don't see how there can be any failure in that. There are always those with "eyes that do not see, and ears that do not hear" In a short time I have benefited from this forum, and I am grateful for it.
 

Wes Bucey

Prophet of Profit
#10
Re: One shot wonders

Mr Bucey,
I am new to this forum, and as such I tend to be reserved about getting involved. But in other forums I have engaged in I have taken the time to track down a couple of people who were "one hit wonders" such as this. What I found at that time were two people who found themselves tasked with trying to learn something in a short period of time and so reacted by frantically searching for a path that made them feel more comfortable. Having found such a path, they never went back to close all the doors they had opened. Not so much as a lack of appreciation, but rather being engrossed in their task, and all else falling by the wayside. (possibly, at one time one of those people was me). I don't believe this to be a failure on the part of anyone here, but rather one of the byproducts of the world we now live in. this forum and the people on it give an opportunity to people around the world, I don't see how there can be any failure in that. There are always those with "eyes that do not see, and ears that do not hear" In a short time I have benefited from this forum, and I am grateful for it.
At least this thread has evolved to have some life, so it isn't all doom and gloom:popcorn:
 
Thread starter Similar threads Forum Replies Date
G New to ISO 9001 - Where to begin? ISO 9000, ISO 9001, and ISO 9004 Quality Management Systems Standards 17
W Where to begin with an ISO 9001:2015 internal audit Internal Auditing 13
supadrai Forced into Regulatory Affairs Role - Where do I begin? Career and Occupation Discussions 4
F Where does Contact begin for Biocompatability? EU Medical Device Regulations 5
J Where to begin to move our company towards ISO 9001 certification ISO 9000, ISO 9001, and ISO 9004 Quality Management Systems Standards 9
J Risk Management - Where to begin? AS9100, IAQG, NADCAP and Aerospace related Standards and Requirements 21
T Implementing a Kaizen Team - Where Should I begin? Lean in Manufacturing and Service Industries 7
R MSA (Measurement Systems Analysis) - Where to begin when setting up a system? Gage R&R (GR&R) and MSA (Measurement Systems Analysis) 14
GStough Where to begin - creating a Quality Plan for Class I Medical Device ISO 13485:2016 - Medical Device Quality Management Systems 7
H Auditing Lean as a process - Where to begin? Internal Auditing 9
T Changing Existing Quality Culture/Program - Where to Begin? Misc. Quality Assurance and Business Systems Related Topics 5
M Quality program, where to begin? One man machine/mold shop Quality Management System (QMS) Manuals 13
C where 2 begin? Info Mgmt Blueprint for internal Communication & knowledge xchange Document Control Systems, Procedures, Forms and Templates 3
CarolX Where does Quality begin? Philosophy, Gurus, Innovation and Evolution 36
M Research and Development Process - Where does research end and development begin? Misc. Quality Assurance and Business Systems Related Topics 15
F Where do I begin for ISO 9K:2K? ISO 9000, ISO 9001, and ISO 9004 Quality Management Systems Standards 4
M Testing criteria - where to place Design and Development of Products and Processes 2
J UDI - Where to document it? EU Medical Device Regulations 8
J Where to get a Black belt certification ASQ, ANAB, UKAS, IAF, IRCA, Exemplar Global and Related Organizations 13
D Any recommendations on where to find experienced quality hires in Chicago area? Job Openings, Consulting and Employment Opportunities 3
J Where is the definition of a critical supplier? ISO 13485:2016 - Medical Device Quality Management Systems 5
W Where does a coatings and paint company fall in IATF? IATF 16949 - Automotive Quality Systems Standard 5
B When Travel is allowed - Where are you going? Travel - Hotels, Motels, Planes and Trains 16
G Where to buy Template / sample SCSMS Manual, checklist Supply Chain Security Management Systems 1
S Where do l get calibration standards to run a calibration lab? Other ISO and International Standards and European Regulations 2
M Quality Manual - Where does Revision History Section go? Document Control Systems, Procedures, Forms and Templates 8
C Where to draw the line for "sufficient evidence" to verify safety/performance of a device? CE Marking (Conformité Européene) / CB Scheme 2
L Where to place the what/when/how/who/where procedures in a multi-regulation AS9110C organisation AS9100, IAQG, NADCAP and Aerospace related Standards and Requirements 3
B Where to acquire EN 868-5 required dye (Amaranth red)? Other Medical Device Related Standards 2
N Where to find Regulations for Reprocessing and Reuse of Single-Use Devices Other Medical Device Related Standards 2
H Where to get EK MED 1927/16 Other Medical Device Regulations World-Wide 3
D Where to find Guidance Class II Amendment Canada Medical Device Regulations 1
O EN 301 489-1 and EN 301 489-17 - Where do we get the information of the Published versions? CE Marking (Conformité Européene) / CB Scheme 1
A AS9100 Training - Where do I start? AS9100, IAQG, NADCAP and Aerospace related Standards and Requirements 14
qualprod Records where apply and stop recording everything? ISO 9000, ISO 9001, and ISO 9004 Quality Management Systems Standards 4
G Gage R&R - Where am I going wrong? Part of a FAIR submission (Aerospace) Gage R&R (GR&R) and MSA (Measurement Systems Analysis) 2
R Where does IATF 16949 address Process mapping? IATF 16949 - Automotive Quality Systems Standard 3
C Where to place CE/label in Sterile IVD EU Medical Device Regulations 1
BeaBea Interesting Discussion Where Does Marketing/ Advertisement of Products fit in to ISO 9001? Process Maps, Process Mapping and Turtle Diagrams 39
K No IFU, where the requirements would go? EU Medical Device Regulations 5
T Assessing Hazard-Related Use Scenarios where control measures exist through standards IEC 62366 - Medical Device Usability Engineering 32
J Where to Place Process Maps in our Documentation? Process Maps, Process Mapping and Turtle Diagrams 4
GreatNate Where to get a KPI dashboard for QMS processes Quality Tools, Improvement and Analysis 5
I Where can I beg, steal (just kidding of course) or borrow good training material on the ISO 9001:2015 standard? ISO 9000, ISO 9001, and ISO 9004 Quality Management Systems Standards 5
A Implementing ISO 20000-1 - Where to start Other ISO and International Standards and European Regulations 2
D Where does "as far as possible" stop? FMEA - EN 14971 ISO 14971 - Medical Device Risk Management 29
qualprod Statistics - Where to start in ISO 9001? ISO 9000, ISO 9001, and ISO 9004 Quality Management Systems Standards 5
H Calibration of InfraRan Vapor Analyzer - where to get calibration for SF6 General Measurement Device and Calibration Topics 2
L Clause 0.4 of ISO 9001 and EHS - Where should I stop the inclusion of EHS in my QMS ISO 9000, ISO 9001, and ISO 9004 Quality Management Systems Standards 8
M Where can I find examples of PPAP? APQP and PPAP 6

Similar threads

Top Bottom