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Where to Start to Implement ISO 9001

Q

QualityKey

#31
Re: Where to Start to Implement ISO9001

JaneB

Thank you for your advice. I read your posts in different threads and find them very useful to me and I want to thank you for that too.

I got the training a few years ago but when it comes to real live implementation it is hard to get right to what the standard say. Some time we do more than what the ISO 9001 requires just because we lack the experince.

After these posts here, I think I should start with defining the real gap by an external auditor.

Guess what!! jsut during the last few days, there has been a proposal to go even for the TL9000, you may have seen my other thread in this forum and in the TL 9000 forum. I am not sure if this is a good decision as of now!!
 
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Q

QualityKey

#32
Re: Where to Start to Implement ISO9001?

I hope I am not confusing QualityKey.

Not at all, I am interested to know more about flowcharting!!

It seems complecated to me espcially when I put the process appraoch concept in mind. But this will come later as I go along with the project.
 
J

JaneB

#33
Re: Where to Start to Implement ISO9001

Thank you for your advice. I read your posts in different threads and find them very useful to me and I want to thank you for that too.
Thanks for the feedback and kind words.

I got the training a few years ago but when it comes to real live implementation it is hard to get right to what the standard say. Some time we do more than what the ISO 9001 requires just because we lack the experince.
Ah yes, the gap between theory and practice :)

My principles:
  • Keep it simple.
  • Make it your system - never, never one 'for the auditor'.
  • Understand that the process of getting there is almost as important as the being there - so don't worry if you 'do more' in places; you may well, but 9001 is just a minimum, not the ultimate benchmark

After these posts here, I think I should start with defining the real gap by an external auditor.
Good idea. But take care in selecting the someone. You want useful and accurate information, not just a 'does not comply' 'does not meet requirements' report.

Guess what!! jsut during the last few days, there has been a proposal to go even for the TL9000, you may have seen my other thread in this forum and in the TL 9000 forum. I am not sure if this is a good decision as of now!!
Guess what? If you've been a year trying (and still going) to make it to 9001 - this might be biting off rather a lot to try and chew at once. Why not do one first (with an eye to adding the other) and then add in?
 
J

JaneB

#34
Re: Where to Start to Implement ISO9001?

the big reason I make flow charts as an auditor is to help understand and assess a process that is described in an encyclopaedic manner in thick process documents. It's not about gap analysis as much as effectiveness analysis
Yes - me too, whether as a consultant or an auditor. Flowcharting /diagramming something that is described in very thick/long document really helps get it clear. And helps see where the detailed documents (if they are needed) fit.

Great prezzo by the way, I missed that one before.
 
Q

QualityKey

#35
Re: Where to Start to Implement ISO9001?

As a conclusion to this thread, I would to thank everybody for giving me the advice I need.

I have printed the whole thread and highlighted all main points and use it as a guide and a work plan.

Thanks to the Cove and thanks to everybody!
 

John Broomfield

Staff member
Super Moderator
#36
Re: Where to Start to Implement ISO9001?

Hi all,

First, I would like to thank the Cove and all members. I would like to say that, for a while, I have been reading in all subjects related to ISO 9001, Process mapping, auditing etc. and have benefited from the wealth of information available.

This is my first time posting a thread here and I am seeking your advice for my case. I have been authorized to be the Project Manager to make it to the ISO 9001:2008 Certificate the soonest possible and with the minimal cost.

I work for a big organization 20,000 employees (Telecommunication Service Provider) and the area which we are going to cover for the certification is the operational sector (5000 employees).

We have so many subcontractors and consultation companies. Most processes are documented but in a different format. So there is a consultation company work for the Design Unit and they use their process and so on for some of the other units.

I feel that most of the things that are required by the ISO are available somewhere but it is either not in the same format or not very organize.

So my role now is to define the starting point and then define the gap and complete it then we will go for certification some time this year.

Therefore, my questions would be:
1- Where should I start?
2- How soon can I get the certificate? or at least be ready for it?
3- Would it be possible that I can use different format of work instruction and subprocess to close the gap in the QMS? or should i re-write them in one format?

Put in mind, that we have completed the L2 processes according to the eTOM framwork but I do not prefer to go any lower than that for now. So the high level processes across the sector are identified, however, the subprocesses/work instruction are in different format due to the dependency on some of the consultation companies/subcontractors.

I have thought to start with writing down the Quality Manaual as a strating point? is this the right way? I want the fastest and the easiest way towards being ready for certification then we can have another project for improvement?

Thanks in advance for any advice you can make. It is much appreciated!
QualityKey,

No need for a traditional gap analysis. You should already have a quality policy and a few quality objectives to show top management's direction and commitment (these documents may need revision later in the system development project).

You are trying to ensure that the system that runs your organization conforms to ISO 9001; you are not really "implementing ISO 9001". Many make this mistake and end up writing a work of fiction around the standard.

Start by analyzing how your organization converts customer needs into cash. Document the results of this analysis preferably using a deployment or swimlane flowchart at the level of your organization, its customers and suppliers.

This determines the key processes in your organization's core process, list these in a spreadsheet and assign the name of an expert to each process.

Then list the key processes that support the core process. These come from ISO 9001 and "common" sense. Be careful not to miss recruiting to go with training (essential for competence) and use active verbs (so corrective action is renamed stopping recurrence of nonconformity).

You should now have a list of key processes each of which is assigned to an owner. Categorize these processes according to the following status: as-is, partly new and new. Partly new is a process you already have but in needs some new controls to conform to ISO 9001. New is a process currently missing from your system (training will be required to put it in place).

Then start understanding and developing the system that runs your business by working with each of the process experts to analyze and document their process to the extent necessary for effective planning, operation and control (you may need lead auditor training to do this well). Ask the process owners to bring with them all existing forms, instructions and other documentation for their process to eliminate duplication and redundancy. Tie only the forms and instructions actually used into the procedures you are creating.

This should take from 3 to six months. When you have completed this work, come back here for more guidance.

BTW, you write the quality manual at the end to describe the system you have discovered. Again if you write the manual to specify the system at the beginning you will end up with a work of fiction.
 
Last edited:
Q

QualityKey

#37
Re: Where to Start to Implement ISO9001?

John

Thanks for your reply, we are at the end of the day here and I need to look to your post with a clear mind tomorrow morning.

Have a good day!:bigwave:
 
J

JaneB

#39
Re: Where to Start to Implement ISO9001?

You offer some good advice, but the rest of your post describes how to perform a type of gap analysis.:D
Yes, I agree.

Good advice. But some confusing statements. eg, Trying to ensure that one's system meets ISO 9001 is not 'implementing ISO 9001' ? :nope: And why would you advise renaming 'corrective action' to the even longer phrase of 'stopping recurrence of nonconformity'?? If you want to advise on using active verbs (again, good advice), why not just 'doing/taking/managing corrective action'? One might as well learn - and use - the shorter & correct term IMO.
 
J

JaneB

#40
Re: Where to Start to Implement ISO9001?

As a conclusion to this thread, I would to thank everybody for giving me the advice I need.

I have printed the whole thread and highlighted all main points and use it as a guide and a work plan.

Thanks to the Cove and thanks to everybody!
You're welcome. I really like it when someone actually takes the time to say thank you (instead of simply vanishing into silence, leaving one with no idea about whether what was said was helpful or not). It leaves me feeling more inclined to respond next time (instead of the opposite).

You also made the effort to explain what was going on, to give more info when needed, and thus you get better advice & people willling to offer help. And I'm betting will do again in future because of that.

As opposed to the 'hey I know zilch, I've read nothing & done no searches, but tell me everything I need to know without me explaining anything - ineffective in my view & I've got other things to do if I want to guess. Like Sudoku and cryptic crosswords :frust:
 
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