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  QS-9000
  Special Processes

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Author Topic:   Special Processes
ASanchez
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Posts: 10
From:Mexico City
Registered: Nov 2000

posted 18 June 2001 01:38 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for ASanchez   Click Here to Email ASanchez     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Does any one knows how can I comply with QS9000 requirements for those processes where results cannot be fully verified by inspection or testing of the product and deficiencies may become aparent only after the product is in use.
Is welding one of these cases?
Thanks
Alex

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Alex Sanchez

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Jim Biz
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Posts: 275
From:ILLINOIS
Registered: Mar 2000

posted 18 June 2001 03:48 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Jim Biz   Click Here to Email Jim Biz     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Can't comment on Qs alone - but under ISO 9002 what we do today is "Qualify the operator" yes -- welding is a Special Process... We have our welders test by an outside source & keep the documentation.

Regards
Jim

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Al Dyer
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Posts: 622
From:Lapeer, MI USA
Registered: Oct 2000

posted 18 June 2001 04:08 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Al Dyer   Click Here to Email Al Dyer     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
The same for QS, the text is in italics so it was taken directly from ISO:1994 and the way we have always approached it is, like Jim, train and qualify the personnel.

I wouldn't want to go down the road of continuous monitoring and control of process parameters unless I was forced. Keep it simple.

ASD...

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ASanchez
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Posts: 10
From:Mexico City
Registered: Nov 2000

posted 18 June 2001 04:38 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for ASanchez   Click Here to Email ASanchez     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Thanks Al and Jim,
but are there any specific requirements for welders qualification?
regards,

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Al Dyer
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Posts: 622
From:Lapeer, MI USA
Registered: Oct 2000

posted 18 June 2001 06:22 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Al Dyer   Click Here to Email Al Dyer     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I'll leave this one to Jim, I haven't welded in 20+ years!

Asd...

[This message has been edited by Al Dyer (edited 18 June 2001).]

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Jim Biz
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Posts: 275
From:ILLINOIS
Registered: Mar 2000

posted 21 June 2001 07:33 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Jim Biz   Click Here to Email Jim Biz     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Yes there are many different qualification requirements for different types of welding.

We do testing that satisfies the AWS (American Welding Society) and our own customers guidelines.

There are any number of tests that can be used for different types of welding - (testing for pipe fitters & constuction weldments differ - as do tests for Brass or sheetmetal welding)

The test we call for is a flat plate - mulitple pass cut & bend process.

If you have a testing labratory in your area - I'm sure they can help you out.

Regards
Jim

[This message has been edited by Jim Biz (edited 21 June 2001).]

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ASanchez
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Posts: 10
From:Mexico City
Registered: Nov 2000

posted 21 June 2001 10:25 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for ASanchez   Click Here to Email ASanchez     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Thanks a lot Jim

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Alex

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E Wall
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Posts: 45
From:Columbus, GA USA
Registered: Jun 2001

posted 21 June 2001 10:30 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for E Wall   Click Here to Email E Wall     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
FYI - welds can be x-rayed. I know there is portable equipment available that is used for construction (but no idea on the $$).

We're currently 9002 certified and received a bang on this from an auditor about a year an a half ago.
The finding:
Contrary to requirements stated in Section 9.0 of the Quality Manual, processes which cannot be fully verified by subsequent inspection have not in all cases identified and qualified. Example: The ___ Process has not been identified as a process which would need to be qualified and records of qualification for the process were not available.

Further, it was not clear if the requirements for qualification of these processes had been defined (who is responsible for the qualification, what tests need to be performed, what records need to be retained, when would the process need to be revalidated, etc.). (Re: ISO 9002, Section 4.9)

The ensuing discussions involved experts from Plant/Corp and R&D; the key thing to keep in mind is what your company has identified as being prudent and cost effective.

Cause of nonconformity:
After review at plant, information sent to DNV Auditor for review. Based on this data (see attached) the first part of the nonconformity was dropped.Second paragraph detail was not adressed in the QCP.

Corrective Action Response:
ECO (#0001235) change to QCP-900. Add New Section 4.1 ãWhen a process is added or redesigned, the Engineer responsible for the new or changed process will determine if it qualifies as a special process. If so, the Engineer will involve the approptiate personnel to satisisfy the requirements of section 5.3. If not, the Engineer will document that the process does not meet the requirements to be called a special process.ä

Implementation of the standards does not expect you to go bankrupt trying to measure 'special processes'. As for certifying the welders, there are usually area tech schools that offer training, but rememeber that any training for competence is what your company determines is required. If you design an in-house program and certify your welders to that I think it would still meet the requirements as long as that is specified (though it may not be the best solution).

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