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  Auditing
  Qualification of Auditor

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Author Topic:   Qualification of Auditor
ricky
unregistered
posted 16 May 2001 05:29 AM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Is it necessary for existing ISO 9000(1994) auditors go through another internal quality audit training ?

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Al Dyer
Forum Wizard

Posts: 622
From:Lapeer, MI USA
Registered: Oct 2000

posted 16 May 2001 05:44 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Al Dyer   Click Here to Email Al Dyer     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by ricky:
Is it necessary for existing ISO 9000(1994) auditors go through another internal quality audit training ?


Is the auditor a registered lead auditor?

ASD...

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energy
Forum Contributor

Posts: 228
From:New Britain, CT
Registered: Nov 2000

posted 16 May 2001 09:02 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for energy   Click Here to Email energy     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Al,
I'm confused. For internal auditing, a company can determine how to train internal auditors. No? I don't believe you have to be a "registered" lead auditor. Are you asking if the auditor group is 2nd or 3rd party auditors? Of course, I'm assuming that the post is talking about internal auditors. (1st party). If so, the internal auditors should be familiar with the "shalls" in the new standard. How you do this is a Top Management decision.
energy

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Fire Girl
Forum Contributor

Posts: 41
From:Orillia, Ontario, Canada
Registered: Apr 2001

posted 16 May 2001 10:11 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Fire Girl   Click Here to Email Fire Girl     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
ricky

It is my understanding, from my registrar that they strongly recommend that you retrain your auditors. My registrar is offering a course exclusively for this. I believe it is only a one day seminar on auditing the new standard. Their feeling is that you need to be auditing with a bit of a different focus. You may train your own auditors (that's what they did at my last company- myself and the quality manager just wrote up a program). But if it will keep your registrar happy it's probably worth the investment.

It's imperative that your internal auditors understand the new standard, otherwise how well they be effective auditors!

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Al Dyer
Forum Wizard

Posts: 622
From:Lapeer, MI USA
Registered: Oct 2000

posted 16 May 2001 12:34 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Al Dyer   Click Here to Email Al Dyer     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Energy,

It may be that I read too deep into the question. What I was looking for is if the auditor in question was a certified lead auditor that keeps up on his/her training or an internal auditor that needs new training to revised standards.

ASD...

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ISO GUY
Forum Contributor

Posts: 81
From:Rochester, NY
Registered: Jan 2000

posted 16 May 2001 01:25 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for ISO GUY   Click Here to Email ISO GUY     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Does the internal auditor have to be trasined to ISO9K2K, i think it would be a good idea, does it have to be by an outside source nope!! I think your Registrar is trying to make you feel that your internal auditors should take the training they offer. I think it would be totally appropriate to train them in-house, as long as you feel that you understand 9K2K.

Does an auditor for a Registrar have to have training for ISO9K2K, yes this is mandated by the Accreditation Board.

Does this clear things up a bit?

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carl
unregistered
posted 17 May 2001 12:45 PM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Why would you need to be trained to ANY standard? Audit training consists of how to effectively audit a system. As soon as you start training on how you can and cannot INTERPRET the standard, you lose your objectivity. As a lead Assessor for the last 8 years, consultant for ISO and and management rep for more than one company I can confidently say you do not have to send anyone out to a course. We can all read the standard. An auditor needs to remain objective and look for EVIDENCE that the standard is being met. If evidence exists, they comply, if not, you have a finding. I am not sending any of my auditors out to training, nor will I shell out my companies money needlessly to go to "transition" training myself. It is one more way to take your money and give you little in return. Save yourself some money, have a 1 hour meeting with all your auditors, quickly step through the 2000 revision and have everyone sign a piece of paper that says "ISO 9001 2000 rev. overview attendees" Don't get sucked in.

All of this is of course in my opinion,

Carl-

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Steve-UK
Lurker (<10 Posts)

Posts: 1
From:Birmingham, West Midlands. UK
Registered: May 2001

posted 21 May 2001 10:23 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Steve-UK   Click Here to Email Steve-UK     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Firstly a big hello from the UK! This is my first 'post' so apologies if Iām not following convention etc.

Although I donāt work for them directly, part of my organisation is the third biggest ĪRegistrarā in the UK, so I suppose most of you would class me as Īthe enemyā! I just wanted to say that I agree with the past comments and think that the registrar previously mentioned is touting for business (incidentally there are strong rules against this action in the UK).

Internal auditors need to be familiar with the layout/references to the new standard ö and understand the Īnewā process approach. However I see no reason for this to be done outside your organisation. In fact there are definite advantages to this being done internally.

Keep your money in your pocket and lets all forget this Īweāll have to keep the registrar happyā mentality (radical thinking or what?!). The important thing is to remember that the object of all this is to improve our organisations; to do things better for us (and our clients/customers etc.), not just to get a certificate on the wall, or to keep on the good side of our registrar!

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