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  When to PPAP?

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Author Topic:   When to PPAP?
chivas industries llc
Lurker (<10 Posts)

Posts: 1
From:sterling hts mi usa
Registered: Jan 2000

posted 10 January 2000 01:56 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for chivas industries llc   Click Here to Email chivas industries llc     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
There is much confusion within our company concerning when certain changes require a new PPAP submission for a current production part. For example, we are switching from receiving our colored resin pre-blended to blending it in-house--using the exact same base resin and colorant our outside compounder was using.

Our APQP manager says we have to re-PPAP and re-do all testing called out by the specs on the assembly drawing, for each component for which we want to blend resin. (i.e. complete level 3 PPAP...) Our engineering manager disagrees, saying that this change should be transparent to our customer.

Under what circumstances, and in what situations, is it required that a subcontractor submit a new PPAP package for a current production part?


Melissa Weiandt
Associate Buyer
Plastics Div.

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Christian Lupo
Forum Contributor

Posts: 117
From:Auburn, NY

posted 11 January 2000 08:11 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Christian Lupo   Click Here to Email Christian Lupo     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
If you are dealing with an automotive customer you DEFINATLY have to re-ppap, unless you get a waiver from your customer. Always ask your customer if you are not sure if you should re-ppap or not. Just make sure you document waht the customer tells you.

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Kevin Mader
Forum Wizard

Posts: 575
From:Seymour, CT USA
Registered: Nov 98

posted 11 January 2000 08:22 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Kevin Mader   Click Here to Email Kevin Mader     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote

As you already know, PPAP attemps to solidify the process of manufacturing and the control planning you set in place to ensure that all requirements are understood and that the process has the potential to produce these requirements. When the approved process changes, the impact must be determined, and the customer notified as appropriate.

What controls were in place for the original resin/colorant blending? Are they called out in the PPAP documentation? Have they changed? My guess is that your APQP person is probably correct. A change from blending at a source to an internal process (perhaps you are new to this process as well) is fairly significant and will likely have different controls (reference section II of the PPAP manual, 3, 7 and 9 on page 2). With these different controls, items such as the Flow Diagram, Control Plan, and FMEA will all be updated to reflect the change.

I hope this helps.



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Marc Smith
Cheech Wizard

Posts: 4119
From:West Chester, OH, USA

posted 12 January 2000 11:03 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Marc Smith   Click Here to Email Marc Smith     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Melissa, I also suggest you do a search here for PPAP as this is a topic which has been discussed a number of times. It might give you some other ideas. I just did a Search for PPAP (all forums) and about 80 threads came up.

...and re-do all testing...
The extent of specific retest(s) depends upon the specifics of the change. I would discuss you change(s) with the customer QA rep and ask what they feel is appropriate. In the past when i did this stuff I would make up a plan (proposal) and get the customer to approve it prior to proceeding with the plan. I would say "This is the proposed change" and "This is what we believe the change will affect." The plan says: "This is what we plan to do to ensure the changes do not change the product features we believe will be affected.

An example: If you machine steel parts which can rust -> a packaging change could prompt PPAP but validation would probably be limited to corrosion studies (if you previously validated this aspect).

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