The Elsmar Cove Business Standards Discussion Forums More Free Files Forum Discussion Thread Post Attachments Listing Elsmar Cove Discussion Forums Main Page
Welcome to what was The Original Cayman Cove Forums!
This thread is carried over and continued in the Current Elsmar Cove Forums

Search the Elsmar Cove!

Wooden Line
This is a "Frozen" Legacy Forum.
Most links on this page do NOT work.
Discussions since 2001 are HERE

Owl Line
The New Elsmar Cove Forums   The New Elsmar Cove Forums
  ISO 14001 And Other Environmental Specs
  ISO14000 In 12 Months

Post New Topic  Post A Reply
profile | register | preferences | faq | search

UBBFriend: Email This Page to Someone! next newest topic | next oldest topic
Author Topic:   ISO14000 In 12 Months
Marc Smith
Cheech Wizard

Posts: 4119
From:West Chester, OH, USA
Registered:

posted 23 November 1999 11:51 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Marc Smith   Click Here to Email Marc Smith     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
>Subject: Q: ISO 14000 time plan /Engum
>From: Kenneth L Engum - Engum_Kenneth_L@CAT.com
>
>One of our customers has requested us to have an environmental program that
>would be equal to ISO 14000 or better. With this memo the customer also asked
>us to supply them with an Environmental Time Plan. We have a time line plan
>for our ISO 9000 but we have not started into the ISO 14000 elements and
>have very little knowledge about the standards. Has anyone gone through this
>that would have some vague idea of an average time that may be required to get
>this written and implemented.

Subject: Re: Q: ISO 14000 time plan /Engum/Whitcomb
Date: Mon, 22 Nov 1999 09:53:21 -0600
From: ISO Standards Discussion - jennejohnn@UWSTOUT.EDU

From: Gary Whitcomb - gary_whitcomb@4funlsi.com

Ken:

We were certified to ISO 14000 in September 1997. We were certified to ISO 9000 in 1996 and recertified in 1999. Our certification efort to ISO 9000 took 18 months. Our certification to ISO 14000 took 12 months.

There are a couple of elements of ISO 14000 that can take time to do, and do right and from my experience wish we had done a better job of as we have spent time re-working and re-tooling. how we address the requirements. The first thing one has to recognize is the Environmental Policy. The writers of this didn't take into consideration that employees need something fairly easy to remember and the componenets of the policy need to be transmitted to the general employee population in ALL Departments, right down to the janitorial staff. The policy tends to be very wordy is my point, and it needs to be well thought out, and CAN be incorportated with your existing Mission or Quality Policy/Statement.

#2. What ever you say in your Environmetal Policy has to be measurable, and documented. If your policy says: " The safest in the industry" how are you measuring that; how do you know? The policy needs to be auditiable.

#3. Legal Requirements: There are federal, state and local requirements for any company, and these are auditied for in your certification audit. This will require you have any such requirements for these requirements up-to-date and can prove it. As we are a medium sized industry , we don't have a corporate leagl department, so we hired an Environmental Consultant company to help us be compliant to "regs". We need to show how we assure we are complaint.

I don't mean to say a company can't become registered to ISO 14000 in a shorter time period than 12 months, but there are some big differences between ISO 14000 and ISO 9000 that can not be addressed by gaining ISO 9000. I'll be happy to establish some conversation with you, without tying up this discusssion line. If you would like to contact me please feel free to do by using my e-mail address shown above.

IP: Logged

Randy
Forum Wizard

Posts: 228
From:Barstow, CA, USA
Registered: Jun 1999

posted 23 November 1999 01:58 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Randy   Click Here to Email Randy     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
There are alot of folks out there making more out of ISO 14000 than there really needs to be.

If you have an in house environmental department that is on the ball and not just drawing overinflated wages you should be 75% there already. There are all kinds of documentation, procedures, training and practices that are already outlined and required, they just need to be tied together with a good working management system.

Get a copy of ISO 14001 and read it from cover to cover.

Have somebody be designated the EMS Guru to coordinate, and start to work.

Write the Policy just like it is outlined in 4.2.

Keep YOUR system as simple as possible. Minimize the amout of documentation required within YOUR system. Have everyone from top to bottom buy in to YOUR system.

Pay particular attention to ASPECTS and IMPACTS (4.3.1).

Set "realistic & achievable" OBJECTIVES & TARGETS (4.3.3).

Make sure communication is maintained (4.4.3).

CHECK and Audit YOUR system and take CORRECTIVE ACTION (4.5).

Keep MANAGEMENT involved by using the REVIEW process (4.6).

It's not as complicated as it seems.

The people making money off of it just want it to seem so.

If you have questions contact me at my E-mail. It doesn't mean much but I am 14000 auditor and maybe I could help.

IP: Logged

Jon Shaver
Forum Contributor

Posts: 38
From:Edgemont, PA, USA
Registered:

posted 23 November 1999 10:58 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Jon Shaver   Click Here to Email Jon Shaver     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
As usual, Randy is right on with his view. Suggest you start with goals & objectives & policy & then take as many parts of your 9000 system as possible (doc control, recordkeeping, mgmt review, & others) & see how they apply to what you want to do with your EMS. Make them apply.Use your management system & ignore whether it is QMS or EMS.
Then get a "gap analysis" to see what you need to do beyond the descriptive parts of a QMS. An EMS is far more specific.

Total time to build an EMS system into a QMS system should not exceed 6 months if your QMS is really working.
Jon

[This message has been edited by Jon Shaver (edited 23 November 1999).]

[This message has been edited by Jon Shaver (edited 23 November 1999).]

IP: Logged

Randy
Forum Wizard

Posts: 228
From:Barstow, CA, USA
Registered: Jun 1999

posted 25 November 1999 04:06 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Randy   Click Here to Email Randy     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Thanks Jon I appreciate the kind words.
Just wish I could actually get involved in what I preach.

We have a sister contract at another Army fort that recently got 14001 registered. One of the hardest challenges they had was in the identification of ASPECTS. I offered my services (which of course would have been FREE, being in the same company and all) to no avail. I have yet to convince my own management team that they don't need to spend tons of money an time on these projects when they have in-house resources.
If you ever get involved in DoD services Contracting you'll understand.

All that organizations need to do is take a systematic approach, utilize and adhere to already existing requirements, keep good documentation, be able to show improvements based on a plan of action, and monitor themselves, while at the same time keeping management involved. It's real easy. There's no reason to jump thru your butt and try to re-invent the wheel and spend tons of money doing so.

IP: Logged

pdboilermaker
Forum Contributor

Posts: 59
From:Russiaville, Indiana, USA
Registered: Apr 99

posted 29 November 1999 09:50 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for pdboilermaker   Click Here to Email pdboilermaker     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Randy:
I am the management representive for both our iso 16949 and iso 14001 programs, our systems are both successfully registered. I am not an enviromental person I am a quality person that was doing the 9000 mgt rep gig.

My boss wanted to be registered to 14001 and after all it was iso so I was the man.
We do not have any enviromental people at my plant and I had a shoe sting, well ¸ a shoe string budget and as I stated no enviromental knowledge of aspects/impacts in application only in standard language.

I did and I recommend to everyone in my situation to get free help from the same outside sources that I used, they include: Fire department, state supported universities (40 hrs/year), the local tree huggers (in my case it is the Wildcat Creek Solid Waste district, found their flyer at Wal-Mart), your state EPA has a "friendly" extension for pollution prevention (they can not by law turn in violations)and the local emergency planning commission.

Additionally this met my requirement for external communications, thrilled my registrar, thrilled my states epa, and made me one of the first registered companies in Indiana. I have the same groups come through annually to review my aspects and add or subtract them as needed. The amout of free help is overwhelming.

Feel free to contact me by phone at work with particular names and contacts that can put you in touch with your states equivilant

IP: Logged

Jon Shaver
Forum Contributor

Posts: 38
From:Edgemont, PA, USA
Registered:

posted 02 December 1999 10:02 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Jon Shaver   Click Here to Email Jon Shaver     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
PD - I like your approach, especially the external communications parts, as you suggest. However, I really wonder why you went for ISO14001 in the first place? (just because your boss wanted it?). If it's just to get certified, then you're probably doing fine.
How are you measuring the effectiveness of your pollution prevention programs ( real programs, not just feel goods)? How about continual improvement? Does the Fire Dept/LEPC run your emergency response plan their way or yours (there is often a big difference). How do you make sure you meet regulations?
Jon

IP: Logged

pdboilermaker
Forum Contributor

Posts: 59
From:Russiaville, Indiana, USA
Registered: Apr 99

posted 02 December 1999 08:43 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for pdboilermaker   Click Here to Email pdboilermaker     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
JON:
Reply#1 - It was a corporate directive to my boss, people that are so high up the org chart that they can't see me with binoculers. I assume as a marketing/sales or cost savings advantage, the same reason all other compines do it.

Reply#2 - First we are a CESG and require no permits, we were clean from the start so to us, there are no "just feel goods". We measure the effectiveness by (our established base line for the current situation/units sold). Using this method we have cut our disposal cost around 50% in one year and cut our potential to emit PM/PM10 by 95%.

Reply#3 - We continue working around our pie chart items, tackling the biggest one that remains w/o a program in place. When we have worked all of the way around the chart, we will revaluate our baselines for each of our aspects.

Reply#4 - The only emergency responses that we are required to have are for fire and tornado. We have used their advice on these two items and had them train us in spill containment techniques for the particular items in our plant. We way over killed and went for the 8 hour training session, so to answer your question we operate according to their advice. After all they are the professionals not us.

Reply#5 - We have an IDEM recommended environmental engineering firm come and do a complete environmental compliance audit every 3 years or sooner if there is a significant change to our process

------------------

[This message has been edited by pdboilermaker (edited 02 December 1999).]

IP: Logged

All times are Eastern Standard Time (USA)

next newest topic | next oldest topic

Administrative Options: Close Topic | Archive/Move | Delete Topic
Post New Topic  Post A Reply Hop to:

Contact Us | The Elsmar Cove Home Page

Your Input Into These Forums Is Appreciated! Thanks!


Main Site Search
Y'All Come Back Now, Ya Hear?
Powered by FreeBSD!Made With A Mac!Powered by Apache!