Management Review - Audit Nonconformance

Dear All,

Hope you guys can advise me.

1. Auditor fault us - Management review non-conform

reason all the input and output is not capture in the management review minutes.

root cause - I can only say the previous MR did not carry out his/her jobs but this is not acceptable to the auditor. so what other root cause i can think of?

Correction - i have top up all the missing input and output. but auditor want to know how to ensure that MR do not miss out any input and output infuture?

corrective action - i want to come out on a checklist for the management review minutes that mean in future this minutes will be check by the management, do you think this will work?
any kind souls please help

thank thank

Re: Management review - Nonconforming

My immediate thought was a checklist.

(However I'm not a great fan of checklists)

Re: Management review - Nonconforming

A check list will only take you so far. You can discuss all the points on the checklist but if there is no action, follow through and verification, you have wasted your time. I think this is what your auditor is getting at. Go to 5.6 in the standard and lay out the format for your meeting from the inputs and outputs. Then document each item discussed and decide what needs to be done. Assign a person to take action when it is required. Follow up on the action and then verify that the action achieved the desired effect. Then be sure to close it out at your next MRM.

Re: Management review - Nonconforming

touchbyangel512 said:

Dear All,

Hope you guys can advise me.

1. Auditor fault us - Management review non-conform

reason all the input and output is not capture in the management review minutes.

root cause - I can only say the previous MR did not carry out his/her jobs but this is not acceptable to the auditor. so what other root cause i can think of?

Correction - i have top up all the missing input and output. but auditor want to know how to ensure that MR do not miss out any input and output infuture?

corrective action - i want to come out on a checklist for the management review minutes that mean in future this minutes will be check by the management, do you think this will work?
any kind souls please help

thank thank

Click to expand...

Was this a minor ncn or major?

Did you do a root cause analysis together with MR and staff to fix the issue?
Are they aware of 5.6 ISO 9001 requirement.
From your writing, it seems to be not clear.
Consider that aspects pertaining to Mgmt responsibility are fundamental in QMS, because they are the pillars of the quality system.

Re: Management review - Nonconforming

touchbyangel512 said:

Dear All,

Hope you guys can advise me.

1. Auditor fault us - Management review non-conform

reason all the input and output is not capture in the management review minutes.

root cause - I can only say the previous MR did not carry out his/her jobs but this is not acceptable to the auditor. so what other root cause i can think of?

Correction - i have top up all the missing input and output. but auditor want to know how to ensure that MR do not miss out any input and output infuture?

corrective action - i want to come out on a checklist for the management review minutes that mean in future this minutes will be check by the management, do you think this will work?
any kind souls please help

thank thank

Click to expand...

Hii touchbyangel512...
Welcome to the Cove.
Did you see that the checklist is made ready for you in the clause 5.6. more specifically in the 5.6.2 and the 5.6.3 .. ???

Re: Management review - Nonconforming

touchbyangel512 said:

Dear All,

root cause - I can only say the previous MR did not carry out his/her jobs but this is not acceptable to the auditor. so what other root cause i can think of?

Click to expand...

Root cause, IMHO, means that u have to put question "Why?" until u get the very first answer - e.g.:"MR did not carry out the job" - why? - because he / she lacks the acknowledgement of ISO clause 5.6 / requirements of ur procedure describng this clause - why? - because he / she was not trained with this clause. So, training MR could be a good start for preventing future ncf.(followed by future verification of effectiveness of this measure, sure)!
Of course, u can continue with 'Why?", but I think enough is enough

Hi Guys,


thank for the responds guy, the previous MR was trained and competent in ISO & OSHA. However this MR failed to carry out his/her jobs.

In the latest MR review minutes i have indicate all the input and output inside the checklists. would this be sufficents?

but i arent able to answer what is the root clause to this problem. is always why why why why why.. untill when can i stop the why questions?

Auditors fault us under NC.

appreciate your help guys!!

5 Whys is always a good start and it also indicates that you are using a formal problem solving methodology (auditor will like it, management usually does not).
Lack of awareness is almost a universal root cause as well as effective communication. Of course effective communication involves not only awareness but also engagement that results in behavioral change. As with my top management I can tell them what the standard requires but I cannot make them believe it or act upon it, especially if it means added re$ource$. We are probably working for the same company because we had the same issue. We put together a management class for ISOTS understanding however, the boss did not want to make it mandatory hence it's "in-effectiveness". If you have true management support they will support adhering to the inputs and outputs and will not second guess your recommendations. Best of luck!

Hi Guy,

thank for the suggestions and respond, i have manage to close the NC. Now i have another headache, i need to merge ISO 14001,9001 and OSHA 18001 together. can someone guide me on this?

touchbyangel512 said:

Hi Guy,

thank for the suggestions and respond, i have manage to close the NC. Now i have another headache, i need to merge ISO 14001,9001 and OSHA 18001 together. can someone guide me on this?

Click to expand...

i think the relationship between different management system are combine and closely, so you only understand the running process for ISO9001:2008 and should be know other system how to working and carry out