External Communications - Should this have been raised as a Minor Non-Conformance?

[TTUK01]

Hi ECF,

From reading through the last Audit which the UK Company I worked for received (recently joined) they have been given a non-conformance on the following:

Minor NC - New
Severn Trent (Water Company) communications, in relation to water usage, could not be retained during the assessment. Company must ensure that an effective system for retaining and retreiving external communications is implemented.

Now I really didnt know, or have never come accross a case where you 'have' to ensure you keep all external communication, and that it can be raised as a non-conformance when referencing the ISO 14001 standard.

Maybe i am wrong, but I thought I would ask on here to see if anyone could confirm / comment.

Thank you.

- TTUK

 

[Jen Kirley]

Re: Should this of been raised as a Minor Non-Conformance?

It's the first time I've seen a direct expectation for record retention of external communications. I don't have the standard in front of me right now though. I presume we are referring to ISO 14001?

 

[TTUK01]

Re: Should this of been raised as a Minor Non-Conformance?

It's the first time I've seen a direct expectation for record retention of external communications. I don't have the standard in front of me right now though. I presume we are referring to ISO 14001?

Hi Jennifer Kirley,

You are correct, the audit was upon ISO 14001.

Thank you for your reply!

- TTUK01

 

[Jen Kirley]

Re: Should this of been raised as a Minor Non-Conformance?

Yes, I thought so. However, if external communications are not logged in a fashion that can be retrieved and reviewed later, there is simply a lack of evidence of the functioning process, which the auditor can rightfully expect to see. I don't like the NC's verbiage though, which implies there is an outright requirement of record retention of this log. Now I have to go get my standard: isn't this supposed to be an input of management review? If so, logically some kind of retention plan is needed.

 

[Jim Wynne]

Re: Should this have been raised as a Minor Non-Conformance?

Hi ECF,

From reading through the last Audit which the UK Company I worked for received (recently joined) they have been given a non-conformance on the following:

Minor NC - New
Severn Trent (Water Company) communications, in relation to water usage, could not be retained during the assessment. Company must ensure that an effective system for retaining and retreiving external communications is implemented.

Now I really didnt know, or have never come accross a case where you 'have' to ensure you keep all external communication, and that it can be raised as a non-conformance when referencing the ISO 14001 standard.

Maybe i am wrong, but I thought I would ask on here to see if anyone could confirm / comment.

Thank you.

- TTUK

Did the auditor cite the requirement that was (allegedly) not fulfilled?

 

[TTUK01]

Re: Should this have been raised as a Minor Non-Conformance?

Did the auditor cite the requirement that was (allegedly) not fulfilled?

Hello Jim Wynne,

I am not sure, as I wasn't at the Company at the time of this audit sadly.
But the statement I typed previous was copied from the Audit Report I have in front of me.

- TTUK01

 

[Jim Wynne]

Re: Should this have been raised as a Minor Non-Conformance?

Hello Jim Wynne,

I am not sure, as I wasn't at the Company at the time of this audit sadly.
But the statement I typed previous was copied from the Audit Report I have in front of me.

- TTUK01

If you're referring to the auditor's report, a nonconformity statement isn't complete without reference to an unfulfilled documented requirement. Was corrective action done to answer the NC?

 

[TTUK01]

Re: Should this have been raised as a Minor Non-Conformance?

If you're referring to the auditor's report, a nonconformity statement isn't complete without reference to an unfulfilled documented requirement. Was corrective action done to answer the NC?

The reference it has is to 'Communication' and Clause '4.3.3'....

At the moment I have done nothing on this action, next Audit is in August.

- TTUK01

 

[Paul Simpson]

Re: External Communications - Should this have been raised as a Minor Non-Conformance

Hi ECF,

From reading through the last Audit which the UK Company I worked for received (recently joined) they have been given a non-conformance on the following:

Minor NC - New
Severn Trent (Water Company) communications, in relation to water usage, could not be retained during the assessment. Company must ensure that an effective system for retaining and retreiving external communications is implemented.

Now I really didnt know, or have never come accross a case where you 'have' to ensure you keep all external communication, and that it can be raised as a non-conformance when referencing the ISO 14001 standard.

Maybe i am wrong, but I thought I would ask on here to see if anyone could confirm / comment.

Thank you.

- TTUK

Firstly welcome!

I would certainly need a bit more information before commenting properly. This can only be an NC if:

• You have water usage as a significant aspect and are doing something about controlling or reducing consumption, or
• Your consumption is somehow restricted under a legal or contractual term (e.g. for water abstraction)

Unless I have misundestood and Severn Trent are asking you questions about your environmental system (which is covered under external communications).

Or the auditor could be making up their own view of what you should be doing!

 

[TTUK01]

Re: External Communications - Should this have been raised as a Minor Non-Conformance

Firstly welcome!


I would certainly need a bit more information before commenting properly. This can only be an NC if:

• You have water usage as a significant aspect and are doing something about controlling or reducing consumption, or
• Your consumption is somehow restricted under a legal or contractual term (e.g. for water abstraction)

Unless I have misundestood and Severn Trent are asking you questions about your environmental system (which is covered under external communications).

Or the auditor could be making up their own view of what you should be doing!

Hi Paul Simpson, thank you for the welcome!

To my knowledge, we had a very small leak with our water system, which cause our water usage to go slighty higher than normal. (It was noticed in the bills)

We asked Severn Trent to investigate.

The Water usage isnt listed as a significant aspect due to its only in moderation of use, and we have set no targets or objectives for it.

There was a few emails bouncing back between the previous person doing my job before I recently started here, but nothing major. Just asking Severn Trent to look into things, to see if there was a mistake.

It was raised as a NC due to they were unable to produce the correspondance between the previous person and Severn Trent... and written in the 'Assessment and Findings Log' upon our Audit Report and as a Minor NC.

I just didnt think a NC could or would be raised on something so insignificant.

Thanks for taking the time to reply!

- TTUK01