Rank of Findings

[Dor Marchan]

Hi there,

Please adivse the following statistics:

1. Rank of Findings per Element in ISO 9002
2. Usual/Common findings for the top 5 (if
possible)in rank.
3. Typicaly planned hours spent by auditors
in their audit per element.

Thanks in advance...regards, Dor Marchan

 

[Marc]

1 and 2 - I'm not sure what you mean by 'rank, but try http://Elsmar.com/level2/failure.html

3 - It depends upon company size and the intent of the audit. If you are looking at a 'compliance audit' (verification - are all the required ISO/QS systems defined in your documentation), you're not looking at but a day or two. If you want to validate your procedures (like in a registration audit) and you have 20,000 employees, it will take a lot longer than if you have 150 employees.

 

[barb butrym]

For a registration or surveillance audit..........
Based on the Lead Auditor experience, the scope of the audit, functions performed and logistics the Lead auditor plans the audit in the RAB required time frame. No other way to say it......

RAB says how many man-days based on size, scope, and # facilities (a matrix). The auditor manages the audit. Areas that sometimes pull extra time ...design, doc control, calibration, process, inspection...anything global.

For Internal audits (since this is the thread topic)........

I typicall do internal audits in 1 -2 hour chunks per team....any more than that taxes resources and becomes ineffective...if an area cannot be covered in that time frame, add more auditors to spread out, or do it in 2 parts.

[This message has been edited by barb butrym (edited 16 September 1999).]

 

[Marc]

Barb: QS9000 has required audit days. You say the RAB prescribes "RAB required time frame" (in audit days?) - is that (the required days and basis) specified in documentation anywhere?

 

[Dor Marchan]

Hi again,
I'm here in Singapore. We will be having an ISO 9002 audit next week...
Maybe, I'll rephrase my inquiry regarding the rank of findings....
There are 19 elements for ISO 9002 (please correct me if I'm wrong) and of course, auditors will have audit findings. During that audit, perhaps, element 4.1 may have 2 finings, other element is 1 finding, and oither element have no finding at all, and so on...I'm interested on the rank (per element) on findings. Is it element 4.9 that have the highest findings? Or is it 4.5 or 4.16, etc..???
Please advise...thank you in advance.
Regards,
Dor Marchan

 

[Marc]

I'm still not clear on what you mean by Rank. If you have 2 findings in 4.1 and 1 in 4.9 and 4 in 4.14 and they're all minors - no problem.
They don't rank findings per se except to say you had the most findings in this element, the next highest in that element. If you get 3 findings in 4.1 and 1 in 4.9, there is nothing saying you had the most findings in 4.1 but 4.9 is more important.

If you mean what are the most common failure modes, that's in the link I posted.

 

[Dor Marchan]

Hi again Mark,
Among the 19 elements in ISO 9002, which element had the most number of non-compliances (or findings - we call it here as findings)? Which element is 2nd to it? Which element is 3rd to it? which elemnt is next?
Please advise...
Regards,
Dor

 

[Dor Marchan]

Hi again Mark,
Among the 19 elements in ISO 9002, which element had the most number of non-compliances (or findings - we call it here as findings)? Which element is 2nd to it? Which element is 3rd to it? which elemnt is next?
Please advise...
Regards,
Dor

 

[Marc]

I don't know of any specific numbers - someone may have some but I don't recall any. Document Control and Calibration were the biggies in the past. Sorry I can't help beyond that and the link I gave above.

 

[Brenda Mundroff]

Are there guidelines issued by the RAB on how
much time should be spent based on number of
employees in the scope? Or is it based on
functions performed?