Our teir 1 customer has requested us to put every last dimension thats on the print on the control plan submitted with PPAP. This would be nearly 300 dimensions. We have always put the customer and process criticals on the CP and this was never questioned. This is an old customer but new individual we are dealing with. Just looking for opinions on this.
Requirement for All Dimensions on the Print on the Control Plan submitted with PPAP
- Thread starter qcman
- Start date
T
True Position
Re: All dimensions on CP
Come up with a cost estimate for the work and submit it as a line item in the quote package. If you want, have two cost estimates: one for the old system, one for the new.
Come up with a cost estimate for the work and submit it as a line item in the quote package. If you want, have two cost estimates: one for the old system, one for the new.
Re: All dimensions on CP
I have always had all of the dimensions on the print in the control plan. If there is a reason for it to be dimensioned, there should be a technique in your system to show evidence that you actually meet the requirement. You may only verify the dimensions one a year in your annual layout. No problem, take credit for that.
But, remember, a key point of the control plan is the last column: what do you do if that dimension ends up being out of control or out of spec. If it is out and you only check it once a year, be ready for some fun.
You can try to charge them for the additional evidence that your system can meet the print, but my guess is that was already covered in contract review and the quoting system (at least you can feel comfortable that it will be their response).
I have always had all of the dimensions on the print in the control plan. If there is a reason for it to be dimensioned, there should be a technique in your system to show evidence that you actually meet the requirement. You may only verify the dimensions one a year in your annual layout. No problem, take credit for that.
But, remember, a key point of the control plan is the last column: what do you do if that dimension ends up being out of control or out of spec. If it is out and you only check it once a year, be ready for some fun.
You can try to charge them for the additional evidence that your system can meet the print, but my guess is that was already covered in contract review and the quoting system (at least you can feel comfortable that it will be their response).
Re: All dimensions on CP
Can anyone here confirm this? By all means correct me if I'm wrong.
I *think* the "standard" requirement is for all Critical Characteristics (and maybe "Special" characteristics) on the print to be on the control plan.
Can anyone here confirm this? By all means correct me if I'm wrong.
Re: All dimensions on CP
The PPAP book only specifies that the control plan meet the customer specific standards.
The PPAP book only specifies that the control plan meet the customer specific standards.
A
Al Dyer
Re: Requirement for All Dimensions on the Print on the Control Plan submitted with PP
Did the customer request that you have a control for every dimension or that they just be listed? If it is just to list them there is minimal cost.
Make life easy and give them what they want until they realize they don't need what they want.
Al...
Did the customer request that you have a control for every dimension or that they just be listed? If it is just to list them there is minimal cost.
Make life easy and give them what they want until they realize they don't need what they want.
Al...
Re: Requirement for All Dimensions on the Print on the Control Plan submitted with PP
If they are on the CP then they need to be controlled-
but the control can be at PPAP only as part of the pre- production CP
If they are on the CP then they need to be controlled-
but the control can be at PPAP only as part of the pre- production CP
Re: All dimensions on CP
ISO/TS 16949:2009:
It seems Controls on Special Characteristics are bare minimum requirement and those on other characteristics analysed in FMEA are quintessential.
ISO/TS 16949:2009:
&
It seems Controls on Special Characteristics are bare minimum requirement and those on other characteristics analysed in FMEA are quintessential.
O
omisquality
Re: Requirement for All Dimensions on the Print on the Control Plan submitted with PP
Hello,
I beleive that for 300 dimensions or more, there is no reason to put all dimensions on the control plan, the dimension to be put on the CP are only dimension that affect Fit or Functionality of the product and dimension that can be checked 100% in our actual process, for ex: a sealing diameter, distance between two clips,
these dimensions are the SC that shoud be classed and poka yoke put in place in your process.
For the other dimensions, should be measured and submitted with the PPAP packaged for each project phase; and also checked during Product Audit.
Hello,
I beleive that for 300 dimensions or more, there is no reason to put all dimensions on the control plan, the dimension to be put on the CP are only dimension that affect Fit or Functionality of the product and dimension that can be checked 100% in our actual process, for ex: a sealing diameter, distance between two clips,
these dimensions are the SC that shoud be classed and poka yoke put in place in your process.
For the other dimensions, should be measured and submitted with the PPAP packaged for each project phase; and also checked during Product Audit.
