Industrial scales and MSA (IATF 16949 requirement 7.1.5.1.1)

[Chiheb G.]

Hi
I have an issue with the IATF 16949:2019 requirement 7.1.5.1.1 which related to MSA.
For industrial balances (maximaum range of 2000 Kg, 5000 Kg,...), used in our case for measuring final product quantities (copper wire spools for automotive industry) and bulk material received from suppliers.
Does the annual calibration of these balances is enough, or we I should include them in MSA studies.

 

[John C. Abnet]

Hi
I have an issue with the IATF 16949:2019 requirement 7.1.5.1.1 which related to MSA.
Does the annual calibration of these balances is enough, or we I should include them in MSA studies.

Good day @Chiheb G.
The calibration simply determines if the device your organization has selected (industrial balance) is measuring properly (within calibration expectations).

Conversely, the MSA activities are intended to determine if your organization has selected the correct measuring device (resolution, R&R, etc..etc...) .

Hope this helps.

Be well.

 

[Golfman25]

IMO, it will depend on who is looking at it. For me, the calibration requirements by most state laws regarding units and measure should be sufficient.

 

[Jim Wynne]

... the MSA activities are intended to determine if your organization has selected the correct measuring device (resolution, R&R, etc..etc...) .

It's the measurement system, not just the device. The system includes specific items to be measured, operators, and ambient conditions such as heat and humidity (in some cases).

 

[Jim Wynne]

Outside of assuring that the scales are working properly via calibration, there's little to be gained by using MSA.

 

[Chiheb G.]

Thank you for your replies.
But if they are stated in the control plans, then we may have no choice than doing it, with no significatif added value.

 

[Ninja]

But if they are stated in the control plans, then we may have no choice than doing it, with no significatif added value.

I suggest that this is actually up to your customer...if they agree (in writing, email) that it is not needed, you're done.

 

[Jim Wynne]

Thank you for your replies.
But if they are stated in the control plans, then we may have no choice than doing it, with no significatif added value.

Does it need to be in the control plan? People use counting scales all day long in shipping and receiving without MSA and without specifics on the control plan.

 

[Chiheb G.]

Does it need to be in the control plan? People use counting scales all day long in shipping and receiving without MSA and without specifics on the control plan.

Yes actually they are in, and I think this is a good point to revise them.

 

[Golfman25]

Thank you for your replies.
But if they are stated in the control plans, then we may have no choice than doing it, with no significatif added value.

Yes. That is a BIG problem. Anything contained in a control plan has to have "blah blah blah." So you need to "weasel" your way around it. We used reference language and notes where possible. Good luck.